Mary Beth Labate: The next item on the agenda is
a proposed resolution for the development of the Octagon
Apartments and Ecological Park. This resolution would
provide... Ken, why don't you just state briefly for the
Board what the resolution would provide.
Kenneth Leitner: The resolution provides that
the President is authorized to confer site control to Octagon and
to negotiate a site control agreement, and to also begin
negotiations on a lease agreement over that particular site, the
execution of which is subject to them completing all their
requirements in the State environmental laws, and that the site
control lasts for a period of six months...
Mary Beth Labate: Thank you. Can I have
a...
Kenneth Leitner: ...and that it's in accord with
the pro forma and some other materials that have previously
[been] provided to the Board.
Mary Beth Labate: Thank you. Are there
any discussions.
Larry Parnes (from audience): [UNINT]
Mary Beth Labate: No, sir, you can't.
Thank you. Can I have a motion?
John Mannix (Board member): Motion.
Mary Beth Labate: Second?
Kenneth Leitner: Do we have a second?
Voice: Second.
Mary Beth Labate: Roll call.
David Kraut (resident Board member):
Discussion? The question I want to ask about the... giving
site control for six months. What does that mean
specifically?
Kenneth Leitner: Basically, it's going to
be... It's gonna probably take the form of a letter
agreement between RIOC and the developer, something that they can
take and shop around to financers and to particular lenders, and
basically lay out the contingencies that they would need to
fulfill in order to enter into the agreement with RIOC to develop
that site.
David Kraut: And the phrase in the resolution,
we negotiate a Lease agreement and a development agreement with
them, it says here only that the execution will be contingent
upon completion of environmental requirements. Does the
development agreement, the Lease agreement, not come back to the
Board at some point?
Kenneth Leitner: The first thing that they would
need to do in order to execute that, basically, what it says
about the timing is that those cannot be executed until that
final environmental action has been taken. So, when that
comes back to the Board at that time...
David Kraut: It does come back to the
Board...?
Kenneth Leitner: When the Board makes its
environmental findings, the Board has to do...
[Voices off-mike]
David Kraut: So you're saying that at a future
time the Board will have a final say-so or sign-off on the
agreement, at such time, after it's negotiated. Is that
correct or not?
Kenneth Leitner: You could add that provision to
it. Yeah, you can add that provision to it. As it
stands right now, we are entering into those negotiations with
them and they cannot be executed until...
Mary Beth Labate: I think... Well, the Board
would be asked to approve the environmental review, which would
be done at the point where the development agreement and the
Lease agreement have been approv... have been negotiated.
The Board would not be approving the development and the Lease
agreements. If it's the sense of the Board that we would
like to approve or at least review those agreements before they
are finalized, that's something that we can do.
Leo Kayser (Board member) Madam Chairman, I
would, my sense, I think, I expressed this previously, in
meetings and probably in executive session, I think it would be a
good idea for this Board to retain final approval to approve the
agreements in final form.
Mary Beth Labate: OK.
Leo Kayser: So they should come back for final
approval.
Mary Beth Labate: OK.
Leo Kayser: Although I realize that there were
general guidelines [that] were given to our negotiators.
Mary Beth Labate: Right.
David Kraut: I would concur generally, I think,
with Leo's statement. I might feel positively toward
advancing the project another step forward, you know, give them a
chance to do the next step in the process, but I would hope that
we would have an opportunity to approve or disapprove the final
negotiations. Is that...?
Leo Kayser: Yes. Approve the final
document [UNINT]...
Mary Beth Labate: Can we amend the resolution
to...
Kenneth Leitner: Sure. Absolutely...
Mary Beth Labate: Is that something we have to
do now or...
Leo Kayser: I guess there ought to be a motion
to amend for that language.
Mary Beth Labate: Can I have a motion to amend
the resolution concerning development of Octagon Apartments and
Ecological Park? The amendment will require that the
development agreement and Lease agreement prior to being entered
into by the President come before the Board.
Voice: So moved.
Voice: Second.
Mary Beth Labate: Roll.
David Kraut: Ken, before we take the roll, do
you write the... do you have a clear sense of what it is
we're voting yea or nay on?
Kenneth Leitner: I have a very clear sense,
thank you.
David Kraut: Thank you, Ken.
Leo Kayser: We're voting on the amendment first,
right?
Mary Beth Labate: Right.
Kenneth Leitner: I'm sorry...?
Mary Beth Labate: First we're voting to make the
amendment.
Kenneth Leitner: You're going to make the
amendment now and then we...
David Kraut: [UNINT]
Kenneth Leitner: OK. [TAKES ROLL; ALL
VOTE AYE or YES: Labate, Reuss, Dawson, Kayser, Kraut, Mannix,
Stewart, Whitaker]
Mary Beth Labate: OK, now, do we have the actual
language we would be approving?
David Kraut: OK, now, as to discuss the
resolution itself, as amended. I will vote for the
resolution tonight because I'm confident that we're only moving
the process forward a single step and we will have a final chance
to say yea or nay before the project is cast in concrete.
That's my understanding. Is that correct?
Mary Beth Labate: That's correct.
Leo Kayser: I move the adoption of the
resolution as amended.
Kenneth Leitner: Second?
Mary Beth Labate: Second.
Kenneth Leitner: [TAKES ROLL; ALL VOTE AYE or
YES]
It's unanimous.
Mary Beth Labate: And I would just like to thank
Rob Ryan and his staff for the excellent work they've done on the
project to date. I think it holds tremendous promise for
the Island and we look forward to further advancing... [UNINT]...
thank you for that.
Robert Ryan (President of RIOC): Thank you.
Mary Beth Labate: Thank you, Rob. There's
one item I'd like to turn to, I guess it would fall under old
business, new business...? Under old business, I would
open it up for discussion among the Board. There has been
some discussion of rescinding the final designation that was
given to Ms. Wilson for development of the minischools.
[APPLAUSE FROM AUDIENCE] She has had what many of us on the
Board feel is ample time to come through with the financing
package and that has not come into place at this point despite
our urging and some representations that she had made that
financing would be forthcoming. So with that, I open it up
to the Board for discussion.
David Kraut: I think it's a matter of concern to
everyone here, and to help me, I'm not partic... [UNINT] on the
ramifications of real estate or the law here, can someone perhaps
list specifically the places where this developer has been
deficient in terms of our agreement so I know what the basis is
of what we're discussing here?
Kenneth Leitner: At this time, David, I think
that would be an inappropriate public discussion at this
time. That should be something, if the Board wants to
review, that you do in executive session.
David Kraut: I should just say that a lot of the
specifics having to do with negotiations have to be confidential
because they're being negotiated and things like that.
They're subject to legal agreements. So I understand why
Ken answered this way, but now I would ask, can we continue to
discuss this matter without airing the specific...? I'm
asking.
Mary Beth Labate: Shall we adjourn into
executive session?
Leo Kayser: It's my sense that, as I understand
it, that we're thinking about a formal vote tonight to send
notice to terminate the, whatever the status is. I'd
like... maybe counsel... to tell us first, what is the status
now... of the relations...? What is our, what is the
status, what is our position, what is RIOC's relationship, if
any, with... Diane Wilson, with...
Robert Ryan: Without going into particulars,
RIOC has requested a number of things from Miss Wilson, and we
have repeatedly requested them, and we have failed to receive
them.
Leo Kayser: And this relates to the... we had
previously discussed in a Board meeting several months ago,
getting a commitment within a certain time frame with respect to
financing that was going to be satisfactory to the President of
the corporation, I believe.
Robert Ryan: Yes, that's an accurate
statement.
Leo Kayser: And I would like to ask the
President, have we received any such evidence of financial
commitment that's satisfactory to you?
Robert Ryan: Not that is satisfactory to me,
no.
Leo Kayser: In that case I would move the
following resolution, that the President be authorized to give
notice, formal notice, to Corporate Realty Partners, and Diane
Wilson, a formal notice of termination of whatever there is that
needs to be terminated, and I leave it to counsel to prepare the
appropriate language for what it is we're terminating, but based
upon the default that we've been informed exists and has existed
for several months, actually Mr. President, how long has this
default been in existence, approximately?
[DISCUSSION off-mike]
Robert Ryan: It's been in excess of three
months.
Leo Kayser: Well, I would leave it to counsel to
prepare the appropriate letter of notice of termination with
appropriate specifics that show that there's been a failure to
perform and a default and that the notice of termination be
given.
Mary Beth Labate: Patrick seconded it, but any
other discussion before we...
John Mannix: I'm going to support the
motion. I have a couple things that I'd just like to point
out. The Board received a copy of the letter that was sent
to Ken Leitner in our package just before we showed up today, so
we haven't had a chance to study it. It's written by a
lawyer, Diane Wilson's lawyer. What troubles me most about
the letter is a reference made by the attorney on the third page
that Ms. Wilson is engaged in negotiations to bring in another
developer-partner on the project, who expects to announce this to
us at the next Board meeting. I think we've given her
ample time to... more than ample time to source the market for
financing. I think we've been more than fair in
accommodating the delays that have occurred. One
particular document that I saw was completely unsatisfactory with
respect to her commitments to finance, so I also second the
motion to rescind the designation and give the President the full
authority to execute the termination as soon as possible.
[APPLAUSE]
Mary Beth Labate: OK. Can I have a roll
call on that, Ken?
David Kraut: I have a question, please.
What's our... what is the risk of legal exposure to this
corporation at this point? Can someone make an assessment
of that, if we should vote to terminate this agreement?
Leo Kayser: The risk of litigation which we
discuss in executive session, that should be something that we
discuss among the Board.
David Kraut: I'm sorry. I understand that
but we keep running into these conflicts over what we're supposed
to be discussing in private and what we're supposed to be
discussing in public, and what we're doing now...
Mary Beth Labate: Well, then...
Kenneth Leitner: [UNINT]
David Kraut: ...Excuse me. What we're
doing now smacks of taking a decision in public based on things
which were not made clear to me in private which I don't care to
go back into private to discuss again. It becomes very
frustrating to me, regardless of how I feel or would eventually
vote on this motion, it becomes very frustrating to me that we
cannot explain in public session why it is we're doing what we're
doing, and I appreciate very much, John, that you did raise a
specific point in that letter, which is I think possibly crucial
to our debate, but you're asking me to vote now without having a
chance to discuss with you in public or private whether we might
get sued by these people, and I think it's a valid question.
Mary Beth Labate: Well, then I suggest we
adjourn to executive session. I take Counsel's advice that
the prospect of litigation is not something that is appropriate
to discuss in a public forum.
David Kraut: And I apologize for not raising
this question earlier. It just hadn't occurred to me.
Mary Beth Labate: No, it's a legitimate
question. Do I have a motion to adjourn into executive
session?
David Kraut: You all understand, we're just
going to go away to talk about this stuff so we can vote it up or
down.
Voice from audience: Yeah, we get it.
David Kraut: Hopefully in less than ten
minutes.
Mary Beth Labate: I have a motion, do I have a
second?
Kenneth Leitner: [TAKES ROLL; ALL VOTE AYE or
YES]
***
[AFTER A 15-MINUTE EXECUTIVE SESSION]
David Kraut: What was the language of the
motion?
Mary Beth Labate: I think it was...
Kenneth Leitner: Yes, it was authorizing the
President to withdraw the previous negotiations and the previous
authorization to enter into a final designation agreement with
the developer...
Has the question been called?
Kenneth Leitner: Not yet.
Mary Beth Labate: Not yet. We have a
motion and we have a second.
Leo Kayser: We have a motion, and still
discussion.
Kenneth Leitner: We have a motion and it's been
seconded. I will do a roll call?
Leo Kayser: Is there any further discussion, I
guess, that's what the...
David Kraut: Why don't you clarify for these
people what we just said?
Mary Beth Labate: I will. We are... There
is a motion before the Board to authorize the President to
rescind the final designation that he was authorized to provide
to Ms. Diane Wilson for the Westview minischools... And I
have a motion and a second.
Kenneth Leitner: ...for the previously-
designated minischool project.
Mary Beth Labate: Right, the previously
designated project.
Kenneth Leitner: Is there any further discussion
before we go to roll call? OK.
[TAKES ROLL; ALL VOTE AYE or YES except Nancy Reuss, who
abstains.]
[APPLAUSE]
Mary Beth Labate: Thank you. I have one
more order of old business. We have a presentation on the
development of the Southtown sports fields. If...
...
David Kramer (of the Hudson Companies): Hi, I'm
David Kramer with the Hudson Companies, on behalf of the Hudson
Companies and the Related Companies, we are joint venture
partners in the development of Southtown. Let me give a
quick status report on Southtown: In December we began widening
the west service drive, which Rob Ryan referred to, which is
going to temporarily handle the two-way traffic, until the
extension of Main Street is completed as part of the
Southtown. In January we began the demolition and the
asbestos abatement on the Nurses Residence, and we're now bidding
the work for the sports field which is going to be a soccer field
and a softball field, and so we have with us tonight Signe
Nielsen, our landscape architect from the landscape architectural
firm of Matthews, Nielsen. Early in her career she
actually worked on designing the kids' playground which is just
south of Blackwell House, and her firm has been involved in all
sorts of wonderful projects in the City including Rockefeller
Park in Battery Park City, the Kips Bay Towers Condominium, the
Lincoln Houses in Manhattan, and she's going to give you a review
of the sports field and also talk about the trees.
Signe Nielsen (Landscape Architect): Thank
you. I don't know how many of you will be able to see
this, but...
...
The soccer field will be located in the, near the Tram on the
east side of the Island, and I think it's going to be a wonderful
improvement from the facilities that you have today. It is
a full-size soccer field, 300 feet long, 150 feet wide, with ten
feet all the way around as a safety zone. In addition, a
softball field, oriented properly for the sun, with 250-foot
left- and right-field lines, with no overlap of the infield with
the soccer field to maximize the length of time the various
sports can be played. There of course will be a backstop
for the softball field, there'll be players' benches, two
drinking fountains, one for the soccer field, one for the
softball field, the perimeter 
will be landscaped, the fields will
be properly sloped, there will be seating all along the new Main
Street looking out over the fields, there'll be additional
bleacher seating for the softball field, there'll be a storage
facility for the equipment, the fields will be fully
irrigated. And the entire site will be surrounded by a
fence.
Audience member: What's the orientation...?
Signe Nielsen: North is this direction.
So the batter-to-home-plate relationship is on a north-south
access.
David Kraut: You want to point to the Tram
building?
Signe Nielsen: This is a turnaround at the end
of the new Main Street. The Tram building is essentially
here. This is the power plant building.
Mary Camper-Titsingh (resident): What about the
trees?
Voice from audience: The river?
Signe Nielsen: The river is here.
OK. Any questions about...
Joan Christianson (resident): The fence around
home plate should be high. You have four-foot fences.
Signe Nielsen: No, around home plate itself is
an official backst...
Joan Christianson: [UNINT, OFF-MIKE}... should
be higher... [UNINT]
Mary Beth Labate: I'd like to interject
here. The Related Company, I would ask for you to stay for
the Town Hall portion of the Meeting so that any questions that
the residents might have on the plans can be answered. But
what I'd like to do now is just proceed to adjournment and then
any questions that you have, certainly they will be here to
answer them along with any other questions that come up.
Signe Nielsen: Sorry, didn't mean to mess up the
procedure here. This board represents four different
colors. In lime green, sort of the brightest green,
represent those existing trees that will remain as part of the
new development... Those trees shown in the darkest green
around the fields I was just describing, as well as the first
three buildings, are the trees to be installed as part of the
Phase One construction. The trees in this intermediate
green will be installed as part of Phase Two, and the trees in
the palest green will be installed as part of Phase Three.
Steve Marcus (resident): Where's the old
trees?
Signe Nielsen: The old trees are shown in lime
green.
[QUESTIONS FROM AUDIENCE]
Mary Beth Labate: Again, we'll finish the
presentation and then take questions.
Signe Nielsen: All right. I will give you
the statistics. There was a gentleman in the audience
showed me an article in your local newspaper that had various
tree counts listed. Those were more or less
accurate. The total number of trees that exist within the
zone shown here is approximately 460. 102 trees will be
saved. And 366 will be removed.
Mary Beth Labate: OK. Does the Board
have... If you would continue with the presentation.
Signe Nielsen: And 519 trees will be
planted.
Mary Beth Labate: Does the Board have any
questions?
[QUESTIONS FROM AUDIENCE]
Mary Beth Labate: OK, again, we'll hold up all
questions for after adjournment. Are there any other
issues the Board would like to raise before adjournment?
OK. Could I have a motion to adjourn?
Voice: So moved.
Voice: Second.
Mary Beth Labate: Roll call.
Kenneth Leitner: [TAKES ROLL; ALL VOTE AYE or
YES]
I believe the...
Mary Beth Labate: Meeting adjourned.
Shirley Margolin (resident): [OFF-MIKE, IN
AUDIENCE, UNINT]
Robert Ryan: That's what's happening now.
Joan Christianson: Good evening. My name
is Joan Christianson and I have lived on Roosevelt Island for
almost 24 years. Honestly I'm happy that I can finally say
you've done something to please this community by ditching the
minischool program.
[APPLAUSE]
Because most of us, I know I'm tired of getting up here month
after month to just complain. But again I'm here to
complain. I stand here tonight I believe representing a
majority of the residents asking you not only to listen to what I
have to say but please take some kind of action.
My topic of choice tonight is Motorgate parking. When I
moved here 24 years ago I was promised, I believe it was by DHCR,
whoever planned this wonderful community, that parking would not
hurt my pocketbook, that the rates would be extremely lower than
Manhattan, and even lower than Queens parking garages. If
that concept has changed, then the residents of this Island
should be provided with someplace else on the Island to park at
no charge to them. You all have a copy of the letter I
wrote to Commissioner Lynch and I apologize that I didn't get it
to most of you sooner. I couldn't get hold of everybody's
address. And I express to Commissioner Lynch my outrage at
the increase for resident parking at Motorgate. I spoke to
Rob Ryan about this and he, you know, told me that there was a
need for this increase and that he didn't need Board approval or
anyone else's approval, he didn't need your advice, that he could
just do it on his own. I've been able to collect a very
large number of signatures in a very short matter of two hours
Sunday afternoon at Motorgate to protest this and I will get a
lot more before I send it to the Governor and a copy to
Commissioner Lynch and to Mr. Ryan and to the rest of you.
But I think that you have to realize where we're coming
from. Ten dollars, you know, like I've been told by
somebody, "Oh, ten dollars isn't a lot of money," but it
is. He got an increase 18 months ago. Rob told me
in so many words that I could get rid of my car as he got rid of
his. Well, I thought about that and besides what I wrote
in the letter to the Commissioner, Rob has a green (I think it's
a) Jeep at his disposal 24 hours a day that was paid for by
Roosevelt Island money during the Blue administration. And
by the way that Jeep is parked outside of Westview school on a
regular basis. It's not been put in Motorgate, which,
again, that's another bone of contention.
Management employees get a discount for parking and some just
park on the street or the courtyards, therefore paying
nothing. Teachers at the school get reduced rates, but I'm
told that they park free near the school or on the street.
When I was working and I chose to drive my car to work, I paid
for my parking and believe me I didn't get any discounts.
I am asking this Board and Commissioner Lynch to advise Mr.
Ryan to leave the rates as they are, or even better maybe roll
them back a little. I have learned in the past couple of
weeks that the profits from Motorgate are divided with Manhattan
Park because they built the extension on the garage.
Another example of the residents getting screwed. Why
should Manhattan Park get paid for something that needed to be
built because Manhattan Park was not in the original plans for
this Island? I'm also curious as to how many Manhattan
Park residents use the garage, since most of the residents in
those buildings seem to be college students.
I could go on with the injustices of Roosevelt Island to
Roosevelt Island residents for hours, but I'm sure you get my
message and my point, so please do something about another slap
in the face for residents. Thank you.
Mary Beth Labate: Thanks, Joan. Ron, can
I ask you, do we have some comparisons of what...
Robert Ryan: We sure do. Could you come
up, please, but before that, I'd just like to comment on
something Mrs. Christianson just said. One of the first
things I did when I arrived on Roosevelt Island is I got rid of
the driver for the Jeep and I also said that I would not, I
didn't think it was right that I be ferried around in a State
vehicle. The only time that Jeep is used is for business
here on the Island and for going to meetings. I do not use
it personally, and I take public transportation to come here and
return home.
Joan Christianson: But it's still at your
disposal, Rob.
Robert Ryan: It is, and it's at the disposal of
the staff and everybody else. Let me also clarify...
Joan Christianson: If...
Robert Ryan: Please. Let me also clarify
a point or two. The garage is operated by a private
entity. We do not operate it. It's like any tenant
in any of the commercial space, and I don't think it's our job to
tell M&D Deli what to charge for their sandwiches. I don't
think it's our job to tell Gristede's what to charge for their
meat. We cannot regulate these things. And the
proper person...
Joan Christianson: [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: Excuse me, please, Joan, I did not
interrupt you.
Joan Christianson: Right.
Robert Ryan: The proper people you should be
talking to if you have a complaint on this is the New York City
Department of Consumer Affairs. They're the ones who
regulate garage rates. It's not our job to regulate garage
rates.
Joan Christianson: May I ask you, didn't you
tell me that Capital, I believe the new entity down there is
Capital, that Capital Parking or Management or whatever...
Robert Ryan: Correct.
Joan Christianson: That they came to you, said
they wanted an increase and you approved it.
Robert Ryan: And I said we had no problem with
it. It isn't our...
Joan Christianson: Well, you should have had a
problem with it.
Robert Ryan: Well, we...
Joan Christianson: I'm sorry, you should have
had a problem...
Robert Ryan: It is not government's job to
regulate the private sector and what they charge for things.
Joan Christianson: [UNINT] ...raise the rates...
[UNINT]
Robert Ryan: I've asked you not to interrupt me
when I'm speaking. I did not interrupt you.
Joan Christianson: Go ahead.
Robert Ryan: Now, if you would like to hear
about the rates and the percentage of the rates, Pat Siconolfi,
our CFO, will respond to those questions, and I please ask that
you don't interrupt him. Pat.
Joan Christianson: Fine. Can I just
comment on something that you said. You're saying that
Consumer Affairs approved this or that they regulate the garage
rates. We were promised something when we moved
here. That promise should not be taken away from us.
Capital did not have the authorization to just increase the rates
on their own. They came to you, so if they came to you,
then you said, "OK."
Robert Ryan: Correct. I take full
responsibility for that action and I have no problem with taking
that action, and if you would please let our CFO respond he will
tell you the whole thing about it and the increase and what it
is. Pat.
Patrick Siconolfi (RIOC CFO): OK, the aggregate
percentage increase is 5%, and that varies by category from a low
of 3%. For one category, the reserved parking goes up by
4%, and the standard tenant parking goes up by 5.8%. Now
you made a statement earlier, which you were concerned about
comparisons to rates in Queens [and] in Manhattan, and so here
are those comparisons. Compared to parking facilities in
Queens, the new rate, which is the primary rate of $180 for
tenant parking, compares to, for instance, a Sylvan Parking
Center on Queens Blvd., the standard rate is $275 a month, which
as you can see is 50% more. The, another comparison, at
Silver Towers, also on Queens Blvd., is $190. So we're
even marginally cheaper than that. Now, the comparison to
Manhattan is interesting. Again, our rate is $180.
Comparison only on the east side of Manhattan since that would be
the most relevant. On York Avenue we have $350 per month,
which is double our rate. On East 62nd Street we have $295
a month...
Voice from audience: OK, OK... we get
[UNINT]
Patrick Siconolfi: I will finish this. On
East 60th Street we have $345 a month. The QuikPark
further down on 62nd Street, $295 a month, and in the same block
on 61st Street, $385 a month. Now the $385 a month is more
than double the Motorgate rate.
Mary Beth Labate: John I know that you had done
some research into the issue.
John Mannix: This was brought up to me earlier
in the week, that this was a subject of controversy. I'm
in the real estate business. I called several owners of
large garage companies, I think total garages owned were about
300. Every garage had an increase this year. Every
single one; not one kept their rates flat. The basic
justification given were really two main items. Cost of
utilities has gone up substantially. Garages have to be
heated and lit and cleaned, and labor's gone up, so...
[VARIOUS UNINT COMMENTS FROM AUDIENCE]
John Mannix: Please, let me talk.
So... Please let me finish. So obviously this is a
concern. It went up, everyone's unhappy about it.
This is not an isolated incident where Rob Ryan raised rates in
the face of everyone else keeping rates flat. Every single
garage and those garage owners raised their rates in
January. Every single one. And the increases were
between 7 and 12 percent.
Joan Christianson: OK, can I comment now?
John Mannix: Please.
Joan Christianson: First of all, we don't live
in Queens, we don't live in Manhattan, we live on Roosevelt
Island. If I lived in Queens or I lived in Manhattan, I
would have the option of parking on the street. If I want
to get up at 7:00 o'clock in the morning to choose alternate side
parking, that's my choice. I don't have that choice
here.
[APPLAUSE]
As far as the garage you quoted in Queens, whatever this
gentleman's name is, I'm sorry, I don't know your name, if I'm
not mistaken, that's not even a residential garage.
Patrick Siconolfi: It is, Joan.
Joan Christianson: OK, whatever, but it's not
fair to compare, if it is, I apologize, that's what somebody told
me. We live on an Island. I mean, if you want to
give me the choice of fighting other people for some parking
space then I'll take it. But I don't have a choice.
I need my car. I have no choice but to park in
Motorgate. I don't think... We had an increase 18
months ago. It's an open garage, they don't pay to heat
it, believe me. The lighting's not that great and there
are very few employees. So, I mean, maybe the costs went
up a bit but I'm concerned that Manhattan Park gets part of the
profit. Nobody's denied that one yet. I think
that's a sweet deal if ever there was one, but Manhattan Park
gets part of the profit over and above the cost. Motorgate
does not lose money. Many years ago during another
administration one of the things that we were told and we all
knew, was that Motorgate was the little cash cow. If you
needed to raise a few dollars on Roosevelt Island, raise the
rates. Well, we all sit back, I'll call and complain,
somebody else might call and complain, enough is enough.
We're getting rent increases, everything else in the world has
increased. We don't have a choice. When I grew up
in Brooklyn, we didn't pay for a garage, we had alternate side of
the street parking. One of the conditions of my having a
car when I got my license was that I got my butt up at 7:00
o'clock in the morning to go find a space, and to move the
car. I want the same choice. You don't want to give
us reasonable rates in Motorgate and keep the rates as they are
or lower them, then give us a place to park on Main Street, or
somewhere else on this Island, because it's not fair; it's just
not fair.
David Kraut: Ummm...
Joan Christianson: Oh, and one more thing
quickly. Non-residents pay less than we do. I don't
understand that one. There was an ad in The New York
Times a few weeks ago offering parking for, I believe, am I
right, $130 a month? And that's indoor parking, that's...
you know... Who saw the ad? I know...
Patrick Siconolfi: Joan, Joan, that's not
correct.
Mary Beth Labate: That's not accurate?
Patrick Siconolfi: That's not correct.
Joan Christianson: Well, all right, with the
rate increase I have here I have a copy of it, and it says, non-
residents, $155, so non-tenants... non-tenants are paying less
than the tenants. That's wrong.
Patrick Siconolfi: Joan, those are fleet parking
arrangements.
Joan Christianson: I don't understand.
Oh, you mean, a company of cars? I don't care what it
is. It's not fair. I don't care if somebody owns
ten cars. So if I buy ten cars can I have... people will
pool together, ten cars as a fleet, do we get it cheaper?
Mary Beth Labate: OK, Joan, I think... The Board
has heard you... The point is made, we appreciate you
comments.
Joan Christianson: And what will be done about
it? You know, what will be done? I know some of you
knew about this already, I wrote to Commissioner Lynch.
Has anything been said? Has anything been discussed?
Or is it just, am I blowing air...?
Mary Beth Labate: No, we hear your points.
As with any points that are raised at these Town Hall Meetings,
we have not suggested that any kind of issue raised with us, we
are going to reverse a position, but it's useful to hear...
We obviously understand that increases are a difficult thing for
anyone to accept.
Joan Christianson: Well, the increase is due for
March 1st, I'm still collecting petitions, and I am go...
If we don't hear something, I am going to call for a boycott of
paying the increase at Motorgate.
Mary Beth Labate: And that's your right.
Joan Christianson: And I will ask the citizens
of this Island to pay what they are paying now.
Patrick Stewart: Madam Chairman, may I address
this issue. As a resident of the Island and a member of
this Board I'd like to go back a bit, not too far, and point out
a couple of what I believe to be salient factors. Number
one, this is the second increase in 18 months. Number two,
as Joan pointed out, there is no street parking on Roosevelt
Island so we have no alternative but to park in Motorgate.
Now, I'm not a lawyer, but that may be restraint of trade.
One of the things that concerns me greatly as a resident of the
Island is that the residents of Northtown have been fighting a
30% increase in their rents of late. I get a notice in my
bill for Motorgate that the rates are going to go up, but they
don't tell me how much they're going to go up. They say,
go down to the garage and pick up a document and that will tell
you. I'm no P.R. guy, either, but that's bad policy, to
tell me to go to the garage and pick up something that is going
to increase my rates. Not right, you know? If we
look at the Motorgate in terms of price-value relationship, and I
think we do need to look at it on that basis, we're looking at a
facility in which the security and maintenance of the building is
appalling. The number of vehicles that are damaged,
stolen, otherwise in that building, I think Chief Fry can attest
to, it's filthy, it's not maintained, it is, the actual
construction of it under a previous administration here has been
in question, I don't know about that, but I think, as... again,
as a citizen of this community and also a member of this Board of
Directors, I think that this is really piling insult upon
injury. I don't know the figures but I doubt seriously
that this will be a substantial increase in revenues. And
I think that the interests of the community, no matter what the
revenues are, are more important.
Leo Kayser: I just have a question for the
President. Is this garage a facility that is owned
currently by RIOC?
Robert Ryan: We have a... Pat?
Patrick Siconolfi: 61% int...
Robert Ryan: We own 61% of it...
Leo Kayser: And who owns the other...?
Robert Ryan: Starrett.
Leo Kayser: Starrett. And what's the
arrangement in terms of who operates it?
Patrick Siconolfi: There's a management
agreement between Starrett and RIOC.
Leo Kayser: And have we basically given Starrett
management control? Who manages it?
Patrick Siconolfi: Management is with...
Robert Ryan: Central Parking.
Patrick Siconolfi: It was previously Edison, now
it's Central Parking.
Leo Kayser: That's pursuant to an agreement
between RIOC and Starrett and Central Parking? In other
words, both parties sign off... and what's the term of that
agreement?
Patrick Siconolfi: I have to review...
Leo Kayser: No problem.
Robert Ryan: It runs out, I think... Rob
[Antonek], do you know?
Patrick Siconolfi: It runs for several more
years.
Leo Kayser: Is this one of the facilities that
we're going, as a Board, at some point, that we're going to
consider selling?
Robert Ryan: That's up to you, the Board.
Leo Kayser: Well, it's something that we could
consider selling. OK. And so... If we
were... I'm competing with a baby [making noise], so it's
a little difficult. So if the Board were to sell the
facility, it would then be put into the private marketplace, and
the manner in which it would be operated would be governed by the
market, and the question of fairness that Miss Christianson
raised would no longer be a factor, would it, because it would be
at that point simply governed by supply and demand and neutral
principles of the market.
Patrick Stewart: If I may, I think with the
advent of Southtown and 5,000 people coming onto this Island, it
is reasonable to expect that that facility will be full and even
more profitable than it already is, so I reckon that selling it
probably would not be such a hot idea.
John Mannix: Well, I think, isn't the heart of
this debate, then, as to whether RIOC will provide to the
residents of Roosevelt Island a subsidized parking facility or
will the free market dictate the pricing on... Isn't that
the heart of the debate?
Robert Ryan: I think it is, and I would like to
add that there are residents here who in fact park in a
subsidized parking area, Pat, and what's the rate on that?
Patrick Siconolfi: That's 114.
Robert Ryan: How much?
Patrick Siconolfi: 114.
Robert Ryan: John? John? Those
people who currently park in the subsidized area, depending on
their housing arrangements, are paying 114.
John Mannix: But I get the... the word
"subsidized" probably was a wrong word. Call it
"regulated..." "Rent-controlled."
Joan Christianson: May I say something?
I'll clarify that. If you live in Eastwood or you live in
2 or 4 River Road, you may park on the rooftop. On the
rooftop presently is $104. When I moved here it was
$20. It's going up to $114. A lot of the people who
park on the roof are on fixed incomes. And there are
people in other buildings on the Island over the past 24 years
whose incomes have become fixed and aren't even eligible to park
on the roof and probably could use the parking up there.
Roosevelt Island is a very unique place. OK? People
here, a lot of us, are living on subsidies; our rents are
subsidized. Our rents go by our income in a lot of the
buildings. Ten dollars to you might not be a lot.
But $10 to a senior citizen, that's on Social Security, getting
$700 a month, that's a big deal. That's a couple of days
worth of food. OK? This is a unique place.
Edison, Motorgate should not be the cash cow of this Island.
John Mannix: What I'm trying to do is focus the
debate on a policy item for the Board to consider as we go
forward, which I'm trying to identify, and David corrected me, is
it, am I correct in identifying the heart of the debate as to
whether the garage should operate as a free-market garage in
whatever way that it operates, or should the policy of RIOC be to
look at the garage and to provide a, not subsidized, but call it
regulated, rent-stabilized, rent-controlled, below-market, or
whatever you want to call it, for the residents? Would you
agree that...?
Joan Christianson: I do agree with you
there. Motorgate should not be sold because none of us
will be able to afford to keep our cars. That's number
one. It has to belong to this Island. And it
doesn't lose money, and it should be subsidized. We have
no choice as to where we park. We have to... It has
to be reasonable rates. It has to be low rates. It
cannot be rates that are exorbitant; it cannot be rates that are
going to hurt people. One of the...
David Kraut: Joan? I think that your...
the debate has become extended from your original contention as
to whether or not the current rates should be raised in
Motorgate. Now, some of your Board members here are
talking about selling the garage.
Joan Christianson: [UNINT]
David Kraut: Excuse me. Excuse me.
...and going totally into a free-market range, so maybe we should
curtail this debate as quickly as we can right now.
Joan Christianson: [UNINT]
Mary Beth Labate: We want these Town Hall
Meetings to be free-style but if we focus the entire evening on
this one issue I'm afraid no one else who has any concerns will
be able to...
Joan Christianson: No, I do agree and I
think...
Mary Beth Labate: The Board has heard your
concerns and...
Joan Christianson: Thank you for the time that
you've given me...
Mary Beth Labate: I think John's framed a good
policy discussion that needs to be had, and clearly...
Joan Christianson: But definitely nobody on this
Island is in favor of selling Motorgate, or in favor of selling
any other part of this Island. Thank you.
Leo Kayser: Madam Chairman, if I could just
respond, there was a statement made that if you had a free-market
rate being set that nobody would be able to afford it on this
Island, and I would suggest that anyone who understands the law
of supply and demand would understand that if nobody could afford
it, then there would be no cars being parked in the garage, and
if there were no cars being parked in the garage, the price would
have to come down. So that actually, what you might end up
having, in a free-market arrangement, you don't know but you may
end up having a... It demands on the number of cars and
what the demand is, and who can afford it on this Island, and it
will take into account the income make-up of the citizenry on
this Island, so that actually when someone...
Joan Christianson: [UNINT]
David Kraut: Joan, sit down, I'll answer
him. Joan? Joan? Leo, by that logic we
should be reducing the rates now to fill up the empty spaces.
Leo Kayser: I'm not finished yet, sir. If
I could just finish... I would like to have a chance
because certainly I think that when it comes to market economics
there's frequently a misunderstanding of what that means and the
implications of it, so I would like to have a chance to
finish... so what happens is that you may end up having
a... certainly you're going to have a more efficient
operation, and it's going to be done with the idea of
maximization of return, so it means that the price that will be
set is going to be set... take into account the composition of
the population and the income level of the population out here,
because that has to be taken into account in the market, so that
the arguments that we hear about taking into consideration on a
command basis these issues gets set automatically in the market
place and the issue of fairness and appropriateness gets put into
the market. And you may find that you have a better
facility and you don't know what the price is going to be set at,
but certainly there'll be a maximization process, so any rate,
the idea that nobody can afford it if it's set at a market rate,
that statement is... just could not be right.
[VOICES FROM AUDIENCE, UNINT]
Mary Beth Labate: OK, could I ask that... why
don't we move forward. If folks have questions on the
landscape issues that Related raised, would you come forward now
so that we, our guests here don't have to remain for the whole
meeting.
John Mannix: David, could I ask a
question? Right before we were cut off, when we adjourned,
we were talking about trees coming out and trees going back
in. Could we just repeat how many trees are coming out and
how many are being replanted?
David Kramer: Let me preface. I will
answer that. Let me just give a little tree speech
here. The tree issue is a difficult issue because there
are trees in Southtown and when you're building in 2000 units and
nine buildings, when you're extending Main Street and putting in
a soccer field and ball field, and a new commons area and new
driveways, it's very difficult because there's so much going
on. Certainly we took it from the point of view that we
wanted to save trees. As Signe said, there are 102 trees
in Southtown that we are saving, and I asked her while she was
speaking why it didn't seem like there were more lime-colored if
it's 102 trees. There's also a very important distinction
about not all trees being created equal in terms of what we're
taking down, and I'm going to ask Signe to talk about that a
little more.
Signe Nielsen: The reason I cut short my
presentation is because I thought there would be a number of
questions in which I would speak about this more fully, but I'm
happy to pursue that right now. As I mentioned, there are
a total of 366 trees that will be removed as part of the total
construction of the nine buildings. Now, what David was
referring to as not all trees being perhaps created equal, there
are an enormous number of "volunteer" trees. Those of you
who know anything about arborculture know what I mean by a
volunteer tree. These are trees that have grown up behind
the Nurses Residence primarily, they are generally six-inch
caliper and less. Those of you who know anything about
trees call them ailanthus trees, Tree of Heaven, the vast
majority are the Tree of Heaven, so if you subtract the volunteer
trees from the total of 366, then 92 trees of merit -- that would
mean oaks, maples, lindens, will be removed. Now, I am a
landscape architect, it is not part of my profession to disdain
large existing trees. We were in a very difficult
situation having to create a quality ball field at the request of
a large number of residents of the Island, and that in turn
resulted in the removal of the majority of the trees in that area
of the design. Now I know that we met earlier last week
with the co-chair of the Tree Board. I went over every
single tree, every species and every caliper being removed.
Those statistics are available from the co-chair of the Tree
Board. I have them with me tonight if anyone wants to see
them. I've also asked for his input on the new species of
new trees to be put in. We sent him the list of trees that
we are considering. We sent him the tree list that is
being proposed for immediate planting upon completion of the ball
field. So, for those of you who have an interest in
diversity of species and such, I would urge you to get in touch
with him, he has all the information.
David Kraut: Well, along those lines, could you
give me a general sense of what kinds of species will be going
in. Not specific counts, but just generally what types of
trees and so forth, roughly.
Signe Nielsen: Let me sort of start out by
saying that the intent of the planting in Southtown will be to
use what are called "native" and "naturalized" trees with an
intent to increase the diversity of species on the Island.
I brought with me also photographs of the trees that we are
considering. There are a variety of evergreens, large,
deciduous shade trees, and flowering understory trees as well as
shrubs. I will get you the book.
David Kraut: That's all right.
[UNINT]
John Mannix: And how many trees are then go...
so we have 316 coming out...
Signe Nielsen: 360.
John Mannix: 360? 92 of which are... are
non-volunteer trees, which are sometimes called weeds, aren't
they? And then of the 360 coming out, how many are going
in when you're done, or...
Signe Nielsen: 419.
How long will it take them to mature? About 200
years?
John Mannix: Of the 419 going in I take it none
of those are volunteer trees or...
[Change of recording media]
Signe Nielsen: ...wide variety of sizes so that
it will not look like a new development. Some trees mature
more rapidly than others. We are proposing to plant trees
such as River Birch; that's a native birch; Amelanchier or a
shadbush, those kinds of trees that are considered rapid-
growing. They will grow in height quickly; in girth, less
quickly. We're also planting trees that will have a
longevity of 200-300 years, so there's a balance, then, of
different types of trees, and maturing and growing at different
rates of speed.
Mary Beth Labate: I think this...
Mary Camper-Titsingh: There is one tree that is
particularly beautiful and it's right at the northwest corner of
the Nurses Residence.
Signe Nielsen: I'm aware of that tree.
Mary Camper-Titsingh: It's a gorgeous
tree. Are you going to save...
Signe Nielsen: I forgot his name, but the
Chairman of the Tree Board...
Mary Camper-Titsingh: Mr. Schwayri.
Signe Nielsen: ...brought this... I mean,
I was aware of it the first moment I came out to the
Island. It was brought to our attention, and I've actually
had someone in my office this entire week figuring out how to
save that tree. And I can just stand before you and say
that we are doing everything we possibly can. It is
currently being protected.
David Kramer: Yeah, I mean, just to give you a
sense of that we did meet with the Tree Board Co-Chair, and he
did specify that tree, and since that meeting I've seen five
faxes come through with different sketches where we're trying to
make it work, because I mean, it all comes down to the details
and trying to make specific details work for specific trees.
Who's paying for all this?
Signe Nielsen: Yes, Hudson is paying for all of
the new landscaping and the sports field. Yes.
Mary Beth Labate: Over here, this question.
Judith Berdy: About the amenities in the plan
you said there was a four-foot high chain link fence? Can
we have a resolution to outlaw any more chain link fences on
Roosevelt Island? I think we've matured past chain link
fences. I think an aesthetic fence around the ball field
or something a little more classy is absolutely needed.
Second, there's no picture there of the Promenade. It's a
line. Are there benches, and what is along the
Promenade? Are there going to be benches there? Are
there going to be sitting areas? What are you planning,
since the Promenade is going to be done the same time the ball
field is done, what is going to be there?
David Kramer: Judy, we don't have anything
proposed for that right now. Right now we're bidding out
the soccer and sports field and we're... we've sort of expedited
this piece of the infrastructure to get it done as soon as
possible.
Judy Berdy: When are you going to have the
materials that you're bidding... well, you're bidding it, the
contractors have to know. What is it going to look
like? What kind of, I mean we have a pretty crumby-looking
ball field now... Are we getting something aesthetic, I mean, you
know, how much money is being spent on this ball field? Is
it going to look like the ball field that was in front of the
Nurses Residence or is it going to have a nicer backfield like up
at Octagon Park?
Voice from audience: [UNINT]
David Kramer: Well, first of all, I mean, the
reason we hired Matthews, Nielsen as the landscape architects and
Gruzen, Samton as the overall design architects is because we
think they do a beautiful job, and we want a beautiful sports
park and certainly, if the intent was to kind of replace what is
currently in Southtown in terms of the soccer field and the
softball field, this is an improvement by many, many
degrees. In terms of the specifications, of course we have
the specifications...
Judy Berdy: Well... We're sure you'd love
to share the design of the benches... comfortable benches, and
aesthetic things before you go out and purchase them, because too
many times on this Island things are purchased, put in, and then
the benches are too high for anyone to sit on, so we'd really
appreciate seeing them before you spend the money on them.
David Kramer: Thank you, Judy.
Mary Beth Labate: Thank you.
Voice from audience: That would raise my
question, I have now, and I want to know [UNINT] ...construction,
where does Blackwell Park fit into all of this? I don't
know anybody who has gone to that park, they call it the baby
park, it is pathetic, it really is. The kids can't play
there. They get splinters in their knees, their heads
stuck in the bridge... This is 2001. [UNINT]
...sandboxes don't even exist. Hey, how can we go about
changing this? [UNINT]... children take it or not.
Robert Ryan: I'd be more than happy if you want
to come to the office and sit down with me, to find a
solution.
Voice from audience: [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: Just call the office tomorrow and
make an appointment anytime you want.
Voice from audience: [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: OK. Give me a call
tomorrow.
Mary Camper-Titsingh: I would like to read
something that Matthew Katz, the President of RIRA, left for
me...
Mary Beth Labate: I'd like to interrupt... I'm
sorry, can I interrupt one second? Are there any other
questions for Related on the trees and landscape? Is yours
related to that?
Mary Camper-Titsingh: No.
Mary Beth Labate: If we could just finish up
those first so that the...
Joe Cristiano (resident): Very simple.
With this ball field and ball park, will there be any parking
facilities there for buses? If we invite teams to play our
residents, or if we allow public schools to play, will there be
any parking facilities? If a bus comes in from Stuyvesant
High School or whatever to use the field, or a special occasion,
will there be facilities for parking?
David Kramer: I mean, [are] you talking about
buses or just any parking?
Joe Cristiano: I'm talking about a coach comes
in with a van full of ball players or a bus comes from a school,
because if the field is going to be as great as you say it is,
somebody's going to rent it to outsiders, OK? I mean,
we're never going to get to use it, let's be honest. If
the public schools [UNINT] that ball field [UNINT] where are they
going to park? I don't mind them coming over on occasion,
but if a busload of kids come in, soccer kids or softball kids or
whatever, where are they going to park? [UNINT]... or some
of them.
Signe Nielsen: We've made provision for four
buses along the street.
Joe Cristiano: On the street. But nothing
near the facility.
Signe Nielsen: Yes, in front.. in fact.
Joe Cristiano: [UNINT] OK, but just be aware of
the fact, I am sure with all the public schools we have they will
be clamoring to use our fields, and they will come by bus, and
they will come by private vehicle and they have to park
somewhere.
Mary Beth Labate: Any other tree questions?
Nurit Marcus (residnet): Yeah, since you're
still working on the details, trying to save this one tree, we're
talking about another 300 trees, and, you know, I don't like to
hear that they're not equal. If I had kids that are not
developing right, I don't like to see them getting killed, just
because they are not developing OK or they are stray or
whatever. So I want you, if you're still working and you
really want to help this community and you are still doing the
details, move the buildings to where there are no trees, where
you are building this ball field. There are no trees in
this ball field, that's why you are designating it as a ball
field...
David Kramer: Actually, if you...
Nurit Marcus: [UNINT] ...that's all I'm
asking...
David Kramer: One of the plans is we had, we
showed the nine, we don't have... with the buildings, the
existing trees, you didn't bring that... I'd be happy to
make this available to RIOC, but we have a drawing that shows all
the existing trees, Signe did a survey, and the footprint of the
nine buildings, and it is amazing how few of the trees there are
on the footprint for the nine buildings. The reason we're
getting rid of the trees, and I really think we should emphasize
that three-quarters of these trees are volunteer trees, is
because of everything involved besides the footprint of the
building, and I would say that, especially if it was the Ramati
plan, which was the prior plan to this, if you look at the
percentage of total acreage on Southtown that the building
footprints are, it is the smallest percentage of all of the
alternate schemes that were suggested for Southtown. I
believe that only 19% of the building footprints in all of
Southtown, only 19% of the total acreage of Southtown is the
building footprints, I think that is the number, 19%, but what
happens is there's the building footprint, there are sidewalks,
there is a Main Street, there is the soccer field and the
softball field, and when you add all of it up it is impossible
not to have an impact on trees.
Voice from audience: Yes, it is, and I told you
how.
David Kramer: I don't believe you told me
anything at all that...
Voice from audience: [UNINT] ... open land that
you're already...
David Kramer: That's a perfect example that
there's always some greater theory out there. The Ramati
plan had high-rises built over the subway tunnel, and there are
limitations. For instance, you can't build over the subway
tunnel, so that limits where you can put the buildings, and I
know that some people think there's a perfect alternative out
there where we would save all the trees and find room for the
buildings, but that's not ever going to be the case.
Joan Christianson (off-mike): My question would
be, I guess a suggestion, that... I would propose that this field
be exclusively for the use of Island residents and Island
youth. AS it stands now the fields on this Island are
rented out to the highest bidder, and there are times that our
children, if they want to have a pickup game, have no place to go
because the fields are rented out. It's going to be a
beautiful field, obviously, it's going to be well-irrigated and
we won't have the problems that we have down at Octagon Park, so
my suggestion would be that this particular field be exclusively
for Island residents and their children... [UNINT]
...arrange that it doesn't get rented out to other people, and
just... The Ramati plan was eliminated by the Board of
Estimate.
Mary Beth Labate: OK, any more tree or
landscape-related questions.
John Mannix: We're trying to let David and his
associate go home.
Mary Camper-Titsingh: Well, before I start with
this, the...
David Kramer: Thank you very much.
Mary Beth Labate: Is your... Do you need
Related here for your questions.
Mary Camper-Titsingh: My name, you need?
Mary Beth Labate: No, do you need these folks
here for your question.
Mary Camper-Titsingh: No, not for me.
Other people might want to...
Arline Jacoby (off-mike): [UNINT] ...I think it
would be marvelous if we could include some public sculpture
within the confines [UNINT]...
Mary Beth Labate: OK, the next person on the
agenda would be Shirley Margolin. I know she's been
waiting...
Shirley Margolin (off-mike): I just want to ask
whether I should use the cane...
Mary Beth Labate: I'm sorry.
Shirley Margolin: This has been a very long
meeting...
Mary Beth Labate: For all of us...
Shirley Margolin: It seems to have gone on
forever, 9:30. I came here because I thought this was
going to be a Town Hall Meeting and that we could exchange a lot
of our feelings and get feedback. 
I've waited
now, I think, two hours, so I'm kind of tired at this
point. What I really want to talk about is a suggestion
made by Mr. Kayser that a marketing consultant has or will be
obtained in order possibly to consider selling off many remaining
parcels of land on Roosevelt Island. I'd like to confirm
that. Is that a motion of the Board to proceed in this
direction?
Leo Kayser: Yes. The Board, in open
session, passed a resolution and I think it was...
Mary Beth Labate: Two meetings ago?
Leo Kayser: ...two meetings ago and it was
reported in the newspaper correctly. It was accurately
reported by The WIRE.
Shirley Margolin: Yeah, I think it hasn't
actually resonated if I'm the first person to respond to
it. Be that as it may, my first question, therefore, is
regarding the survey, will a consultant solicit the interest of
all the cultural institutions of the City and the State?
Leo Kayser: I'm sorry, I didn't hear the
question.
Shirley Margolin: My second question is, will
the consultant solicit the interest of all of the cultural
institutions of the City and the State? I'm talking
about...
Leo Kayser: I hear the question.
Shirley Margolin: OK.
Leo Kayser: The answer is, is that the marketing
agent we're actually in the process of engaging, and by putting
properties on the market and giving public notice, every element
of society, including, but not limited to, those that you just
referred to, will have a full opportunity to make their offers,
their bids...
Shirley Margolin: OK, my third question, then,
thank you, is Southpoint Park, therefore, part of that selling-
off?
Leo Kayser: Well...
Shirley Margolin: Is that 10.2 acres of the most
exciting view in the City of New York probably, the most
astonishing place on the East River, and one of the great assets
of this community for all purposes, viewing, a place of quiet
contemplation, a place where, when we have critical mass, it will
be sought out not only by residents but by everybody else... is
that on the block?
Leo Kayser: In terms of geography, I think, Rob,
the whole, the whole, what areas... When you're talking
about 10.2 acres, I don't know specifically what you're
talking...
Mary Beth Labate: Specific areas have not been
identified. That would be one of the, one of what we'd be
looking for the consultant to give us advice on. Clearly,
it would have to be in conformance with the General Development
Plan.
Shirley Margolin: Yes, indeed.
Mary Beth Labate: But we have not gone to the
consultant and said, give us ideas for this or that parcel.
We would expect the consultant to come back to us with...
Shirley Margolin: Well, I would suggest that the
residents would feel very, very strongly, would have to take into
consideration the General Development Plan, and I, as a person
who has lived here from the beginning, who has been the assistant
to three commissioners of DHCR, I have been very involved for
many, many years with Southpoint Park, and I began to do some
research and I went back to the original plan of the Welfare
Island which preceded Roosevelt Island, and I thought it was
interesting to read to you and bring to your attention,
Southpoint Park and Lighthouse Parks, with their landmark
buildings and spectacular views and comparative isolation, are
basically not available for intensive programmed
activities. They lend themselves instead to quiet and
reflection – park purposes, somewhat neglected in recent
years. Such park developments may have critical difficulties
but they are important for the sense of the development of this
community. I am very concerned about any effort to sell
off Southpoint Park. It is the place that is so revered by
everybody. We're going to need it when we have critical
mass on this Island. There has to be a place to go.
It was created in the name of FDR and it should remain a place of
quiet and contemplation. That is not to say that... on the
footprint of the original hospital, there are opportunities for
some of the cultural institutions to do some creative thinking
and planning. I hope you will really create a committee
here, because it is such a special place, and so important for
the future of the Island to bring in some very top people, like
Mr. Calatrava, who did such a marvelous, if you are familiar with
it, a wonderful garden, garden arrangement several years ago, and
then I open up The New York Times and see how he is being
lauded for his creativity and the things he has done.
We've had wonderful people, you know, right from the beginning,
helping us, Burgee and Johnson, what could be better than those
architects? I urge you not to tamper with the wonderful
work that has been done in the future development and plans of
this Island, and in particular, Southpoint Point is not for
sale. Shouldn't be. We met that issue with Mr.
Jamal. I can't think of a single resident here who thought
that proposal had any merit. I remind you again,
Southpoint Park is ours. I hope that we can work together
to find other funds and that we can begin to address the
development of Southpoint Park for everybody. That should
be an important part of your agenda. You have any
comments, I'd like to hear...
John Mannix: I'd like to say a couple
things. Undoubtedly, the land at Southpoint Park is a
spectacular piece of land. But it's a rubble-strewn wreck,
vermin-infested mass. It'll take a lot of money to turn
into the beautiful place that you envision.
Shirley Margolin: Yes.
John Mannix: The only way that that's going to
happen is to have some development take place on that piece of
land. Now, I share your view of the Jamal project.
I couldn't, in my own personal opinion, conceive of a less
congruous project for that piece of land.
Shirley Margolin: Correct. It's offensive
to all of us.
[APPLAUSE]
John Mannix: This is a personal opinion, so
we're in open debate. I just couldn't conceive of a
project that was more wrong...
Shirley Margolin: Right...
John Mannix: ...for that piece of land down
there. But I do think that we need to be realistic in
looking at how we make that a beautiful park for the residents,
and it's going to take a lot of money, and we're gonna have to do
something there, reasonable... We would love to get the
Guggenheim to come there. Are we gonna try?
Yes. That's why we're hiring a marketing consultant that
has the networks. Is that gonna work? We don't
know. That's in front of us. But I think, to be
very realistic and understanding, that nobody's going to come and
drop a bag of money on top of RIOC to develop the park. We
need to source it out and come up with the best plan so it turns
into what you want.
Shirley Margolin: Yes, I agree, and I think that
you will create a committee for this purpose, and that you will
involve us, because again, I do believe that the cultural
institutions of this community are in a mode of, they are
advancing, they are seeking sites, and the point is, that should
be the role of the marketing consultant. It should start
first with the cultural institutions. That's where we
should start. I just want to be sure that we're not going
to revisit another Jamal situation. That's my
concern. It's a concern of everybody; you know that.
So I suggest... I wish you well. I think, again,
involving the citizens of the Island in this endeavor is
important and, really, it was uncomfortable to hear that Mr.
Jamal again might have some interest in it, so let's put that
issue to bed after this long evening.
Mary Beth Labate: OK, thank you.
Can... If we're... Again, I'd like to follow
through the people who signed up initially. Larry Parnes
is... He's gone? OK.
Linda Heimer (resident): I'm on the list, and my
point follows...
Mary Beth Labate: OK, you're not too far...
OK.
Linda Heimer: Good evening. I'm a little
tall for this. The article that... thank you... The
article that Shirley referred to was in Crain's New York
on February 2nd, a Friday, and it asked for response by Tuesday,
and since it didn't indicate which Tuesday, I'm assuming it meant
the following Tuesday, February 6, and one of my questions is,
isn't that a very short time for someone to prepare an RFP to
respond and make a proposal...
Mary Beth Labate: Are you talking about the real
estate consultant?
Linda Heimer: It could indicate that you've
already decided on someone, and are just doing this pro forma, I
don't know if that's the case and, if it is the case, who have
you identified or selected? That's my first
question. Why were there only two business days to
respond?
Robert Ryan: No, there wasn't two business
days.
Patrick Siconolfi: It was four weeks, was the
response time. There were six respondees, and we're
evaluating the responses right now.
Linda Heimer: OK, because it didn't say which
Tuesday.
Siconolfi (off-mike): ...published in the
New...
Robert Ryan: Right, it was published in The
New York State Contract Reporter, there was a meeting out
here with all interested parties. I think there were, how
many altogether came out?
Patrick Siconolfi: At least the six...
Robert Ryan: Well, I think there was, like,
around ten or something, and six, six actually responded.
Linda Heimer: So you're still in the process of
selecting? OK. Will you inform these sales agents
and developers that all developments must conform to the
GDP? I think you've... someone responded that you would do
that.
Robert Ryan: Well, they're gonna... We
are providing them with a whole bunch of information, part of
which is the GDP.
Linda Heimer: Well, if you do tell them this,
then all the sites have been identified already in the GDP.
All the sites have been identified in the GDP. So you
don't really need a sales agent to find out where there should be
development. You know, it said they were hired to find
sales sites, development sites, and the GDP does that for you
already. If you're not going to tell them they must
conform to the GDP, then it's breaking the law. So it's
one or the other and so I don't really understand the need for a
sales agent. For Southpoint Park, I can understand where
you might need someone, as Shirley was saying, to look into
cultural institutions. I think it's a wonderful
idea. But to identify development sites on the
Island? They have been identified since 1969 in the GDP as
part of the Lease. And my last question...
John Mannix: Could I address that quickly?
Linda Heimer: Yes, please.
John Mannix: The, the... There are
various sites that are identified for development. There
are various other buildings for possible adaptive reuse.
There are other sites that could be renovated, so I think what
we're looking for a sales consultant, the marketing consultant to
tell us, is to use their information that we may not be aware
of. For example, a lot of the cultural institutions.
Perhaps the Racquet Club. I think there are a variety of
things that we need to get information on, so this is an
information sourcing from an expert in the marketplace, and I
will tell you I personally know three of the firms that
responded, the highest quality, a couple of them international
firms, so we're talking about very top-quality people to come
help us determine, within the scope of the GDP, how we can, you
know, maximize some of the assets that may not be visible to the
eye right now. And I don't just mean land.
Linda Heimer: So it's within the scope of the
GDP.
John Mannix: Absolutely. And I believe
that was directly in the RFP.
Linda Heimer: Because, you know, Southtown
isn't, so, you know, that's why...
John Mannix: I guess people have differences of
opinion on that...
Robert Ryan: [UNINT] ... It is under litigation
and that would not be appropriate.
Linda Heimer: And you can't discuss it and I'm
not discussing it, either. I just made a point. OK,
so, is there no one on this Board, and half the Board is gone,
unfortunately, because it's so late. Is there no one on
this Board that is upset about selling off parcels of Roosevelt
Island to the highest bidder until there is nothing but concrete
and very little open space and parkland left?
Mary Beth Labate: Can I... Let me just comment
on that...
Linda Heimer: Sure.
Mary Beth Labate: Your question is, is no one
upset with... The intention of this Board in looking at
parcels that have potential development opportunities is... It's
not an end to itself. The intention here is to help this
Island and its residents generate the capital that is needed to
address many of the issues that you bring before us. You
know, as you have said, as the Board has said, there is no pot of
money out there that is going to do these things unless we
generate it ourselves. The Island is only going to be as
good, and some of the improvements you want are only going to
materialize, when there is, there is money available to do
infrastructure. If someone could come forward with a pot
of money that we don't know of, we welcome it, but we don't see
it, clearly it's evident from the Island that it's not there
right now.
Linda Heimer: All right. I know you can't
comment on this 'cause we're in litigation, but the Southtown
plan, the numbers are not bringing us the money you're talking
about. If you're saying you need the money to develop, to
bring in money, the figures are all off. It is a giveaway
of very valuable land. So you don't need to comment.
I'm making a statement. I don't know where, why you keep
saying you need money. RIOC has said, you've been saying
this for four, maybe five years now, they're self-
sufficient. Why do we need money? And if we do need
money, then we're not self-sufficient. Something's
wrong. And the reason why we don't know is 'cause we can't
get figures. Rob, you promised [State Sen.] Olga [Mendez]
in our meeting with her that you would give her an audited report
the next day. She says she still doesn't have it.
Can we have one?
Robert Ryan:
You sure can. They're [UNINT] ...at the last Board
meeting, and we told anybody who wanted one to come by...
Linda Heimer: Audited report?
Audited?
Robert Ryan: Yes, our audited 2000, and we told
anybody, we had them here and we told anybody who wanted one
could come by and we would make them a copy.
Linda Heimer: OK, we'll come by tomorrow.
Will you have a copy for me tomorrow?
Robert Ryan: Pat, can you take care of that?
Patrick Siconolfi: We'll take care of that
tomorrow.
Linda Heimer: Thank you. OK.
Mary Beth Labate: Just in terms of self...
Pat, chime in here. RIOC is operationally self-sufficient,
your basic operation and maintenance, this Island is self-
sufficient. What this Board is looking to do is to create
a pool of money that can be used for longer-term infrastructure
and capital needs. Most budgets have an operating
component and a capital component. RIOC does not currently
generate the funds to amass sufficient support for that capital
component, that basic infrastructure component.
Linda Heimer: And I would like to know, I agree
with that, I think that's probably true, you have operating
funds, maybe, but the capital funds need to be... Why are
you not asking the State for money that every other community
gets for their tax dollars? [APPLAUSE] Why are we not
getting anything? Why must Roosevelt Island be the only
place, the only community in New York State that must be self-
sufficient. The Tram can't be subsidized like every other
form of transportation in the United States... Why must
these residents always pay through the nose for everything?
What are we getting in return for our tax dollars?
Leo Kayser: Madam Chairman, may I respond to
this kind of question? First of all, there are...
Actually, you posed about three separate questions and each of
them, if it were, if I were in a courtroom, I would be objecting
to it in terms of matter of form, but...
Linda Heimer: I'm sorry, I'm not an
attorney.
Leo Kayser: May I just, may I just respond,
please, without being interrupted... in that the questions state
facts, which are either inaccurate or, or are so, basically
rhetorical, that it isn't, that you're not really soliciting
information, but... First of all, this Island has some
major benefits which can be capitalized, which other communities
do not have. One of the major benefits that this Island
has is that for the next 68 years there are no real estate taxes
paid on this Island. The fact that you all do not pay any
real estate taxes, and is not in your cost structure, is a great
benefit to you, which, if realized and capitalized and put to
your benefit, put to your advantage, makes it possible for this
Island to do everything it needs to do with the exception of the
seawall, and so forth, but everything else can be done within
what you have given to you right here, and that's what we're
trying to do.
Robert Ryan: And I might add that both the Tram
and the bus system are subsidized. We lose about $750,000
on the Tram and we lose about $600,000-plus on the bus
system.
Linda Heimer: Yes, I realize that, but RIOC has
been trying to make us be responsible for it and, when they keep
talking about new legislation, about running the Island, it has
to be fully paid and so forth, and no other form of
transportation is, and we don't have the Metrocard, and so forth,
and that's a whole 'nother thing. But the point is that
Dr. Blue and RIOC in general keep complaining that it has to be
subsidized. You know, the truth is, we do not get our fair
shake for the dollars we pay in State and City taxes because
we're an anomaly. We fall through the cracks of City and
State and we're like orphans here. This is... I
really would like to be proven wrong, Mr. Kayser, I really would,
but I'd like to see the figures. No one will give us the
figures. We can't get the Seawall Report, we can't get the
audited report -- I'll come tomorrow and I'll get that, hopefully
-- but you keep quoting figures that we don't have proof
of. You just keep telling us. I'd like to be proven
wrong, I really would, because that would make me feel
better. But, I don't want to see, no matter what the
figures are, I don't want to see the Island sold off to the
highest bidder, especially without resident input.
Leo Kayser: Is it that you prefer to have it
sold off to lower bidders?
Linda Heimer: I don't want to see it sold off at
all.
Leo Kayser: In other words, so your point is,
you don't want to see any of the mechanisms that rationally can
be brought to bear to capitalize the tax-free status for the next
68 years of this Island, for the benefit of the people on this
Island. That's your position from what I can see.
You would like to deny the citizens of this Island the
opportunities that exist for the citizens of this Island with
respect to what's been provided for the unique status of this
Island.
Linda Heimer: No. That's not what I'm
saying...
Leo Kayser: Well, you see...
Linda Heimer: Number one, I would like to see
any development on this Island consistent with the GDP and you've
promised to look into that and do that. I hope that's
true, because so far we haven't seen that. As I believe it
was Mr. Mannix who said, or Mr. Kraut said, it was Mr. Kraut, in
exchange for giving away so much land at Octagon we're getting
this and this. But you're breaking the GDP to do that so
please get it amended instead. Follow the rules.
Southtown is also breaking the GDP. Rob Ryan says, no,
there's a court decision that says that's not true. Well,
we're appealing that and we won't discuss it. But I'm
saying that you are breaking the GDP and it's consistently
happening instead of following the rules, following the original
vision of this Island and getting resident input. I do
applaud you for this evening because you're giving us a chance to
give you some real input. For the first time I feel like
there's some real dialog going on and I appreciate that.
But we want input that makes a difference. When it came to
Southtown, we'd come to these meetings, were not allowed to make
any statements, we could just ask a question, three minutes, and
we had to sit down. And nothing was followed. I
mean, they promised us they would barge in materials, now it's
too expensive. They promised us they'd put in Z-bricks on
the Main Street, they're not going to do that now. They
promised us they'd take down very few trees; I don't think 366
trees is very few. I mean, it just goes on and on.
So, listening to us is one thing, but really doing part of what
we say because we live here, we have to live with this, is
another. I'm not going to take up any more time, but I
would... Steve... I request. Steve is also on the
list, he knows more about the figures, if you would permit him to
go next.
Mary Beth Labate: Is Margie Smith still with
us?
Steve Marcus (resident): You folks have stated
on a number of occasions that your objective is really to squeeze
as much out of construction, development of Roosevelt Island as
is possible. You've done that with the Octagon project
where Becker and Becker had said that... they even said it in a
RIRA meeting, that RIOC wants a maximum immediate payment of
moneys. In fact, one of the members even suggested that
you go 28 floors to maximize the income that you're going to
get. 
Mr. Kayser's explained his plans to... you
know, parcels of open space, and he also mentioned, which I was
interested in, for a one-time payment, for example, in FDR park,
or in Sportspark or any of the other areas, he's interested in
generating a large one-time income for leasing out the
area. Even negotiations to privatize some of these
Mitchell-Lama buildings that we have here involve a one-time
payment in lieu of annual taxes. So I have a couple of
questions. One is, what is the pressing need for so much
one-time up-front income? The next question is, if you
succeeded in leasing out all of Roosevelt Island, all of the open
spaces, today, where would an income stream come in years three,
four, and five and so on? Another question is that, 15
months ago, Mr. Ryan, I asked you how much money you think that
you'd like to get out of Roosevelt Island to satisfy you and the
Board. You said that you had a CFO and he really didn't
have his feet wet yet, and you'd provide an answer within a
couple of months. So, it's well more than a couple of
months. Do you have an answer? How much money are
you guys gonna be happy with. And finally, in ten or
twelve years, when the whole Island is paved over, we've got
hotels and we've got all kinds of stuff here and we've generated
an awful lot of money for the State, are you guys going to be
proud of what you've done here when you look in 10, 20, 30 years
and there's no open spaces left, or very little, and instead what
you have is a bunch of buildings that are starting to look
dilapidated? Those are my questions.
Robert Ryan: Leo, do you want to go first?
John Mannix: I'd just like to address a couple
of the more, let's say, technical and financial issues.
RIOC is a large real estate company. That's all it really
is. You call it a State agency, but when you boil it down
to its essence, it's a large real estate company. It's a
large real estate company that barely breaks even on an operating
basis, and has effectively zero liquidity. If you took the
RIOC balance sheet and converted it pro forma and brought it to a
banker, he'd say you're bankrupt. You can't operate a real
estate company bankrupt. The intent, in a sensible
fashion, rather than to squeeze as much out as possible, in a
sensible fashion, is to fix the balance sheet of RIOC so that it
can operate like what it is, a real estate company, which means
it has enough liquidity to handle crises, has liquidity to handle
a five-year capital plan, has cash in the bank to support its
ongoing activities. So I think that in essence is the
exercise that we are undergoing with respect to raising
capital. This is an investment-banking exercise, at its
core, which is to fix the balance sheet of RIOC given the
considerations under way, given the fact that we, that the Island
has...
Steve Marcus: Where do the taxes that we pay
come into this? Because clearly, if you're just looking at
the amount of revenues that you're getting from the buildings and
so forth, that's one set, but we also pay a lot of taxes to the
State. Shouldn't the State be returning some of this to
us?
Leo Kayser: Well, there are different elements
of taxes, but whenever you go out on the roads in the State of
New York, those taxes that you pay are there. You move
around this State, in many areas... What you don't pay is
a real estate tax, which is the largest... for somebody of a
middle-class or... I don't know all the different income
levels, but when you start looking at different situations where
people live in the State of New York, you get a lower-middle-
class income, the largest tax that that person pays in the State
of New York is the real estate tax. It's not the income
tax, it's not the sales tax, it's the real estate tax. You
all pay no real estate tax here.
Steve Marcus: [UNINT]... PILOTs.
Leo Kayser: What you do pay is sales taxes on
what you buy, and you pay income, state income taxes that you
pay.
Steve Marcus: [UNINT]
Leo Kayser: It depends on what your taxes
are.
Steve Marcus: How about PILOTs and ground rents
that are assessed in our rents for everybody on Roosevelt
Island.
Nancy Reuss (off-mike): [UNINT] ...funds were
used to support infrastructure that was originally used to build
out the Island.
Steve Marcus: OK.
Leo Kayser: But the fact it you're so far
insolvent with respect... You have a $123 million debt,
but...
Voice from audience: We do not. The State
does. Roosevelt Island does not...
Leo Kayser: The corporation has... the
corporation has... you're interrupting me. I think you
don't want to hear the facts. The Corporation has a $120-
some-odd million debt.
Steve Marcus: RIOC or the...
Leo Kayser: That debt has been... the
arrangements between this corporation and the State of New
York... The State of New York has renegotiated on at least three
separate occasions, under allocation agreements, how... so that
you effectively have had the suspension of the requirement of
servicing your debt.
Nurit Marcus (off-mike): RIOC has nothing to do
with the debt. [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: You know, we don't interrupt the
speakers. It's appropriate that the crowd do not interrupt
the Board members, OK?, who are spending time here trying to
answer your questions. I find it very rude.
Leo Kayser: OK, the fact is, when you begin to
look at the finances here, the State of New York is... is
massively subsidizing your existence on this Island right
now. Massively. More so probably, I haven't looked
at every community in the State of New York, but if you were to
make a survey, I suspect you're in the top one percent of
communities in the State of New York in terms of what the State
of New York has done for this Island.
Steve Marcus: If you folks generate...
Leo Kayser: And, and, and we have on this Island
the opportunity of being capitalized, self-sufficient, as well as
on an operating basis. We have that opportunity.
And we have the opportunity of, and the State of New York, I
think we would like to enter into negotiations and have a debt
forgiveness arrangement, to some extent, but we have to negotiate
that too before we accumulate too much cash and it is snatched
from us in this process. But we would like to...
Steve Marcus: Mr. Kayser...
Leo Kayser: I'm just trying to give you an
overview...
Steve Marcus: I've read the bond agreement and
as far as I can see...
Leo Kayser: You've read what?
Steve Marcus: The bond agreement, the
refinancing agreement and so forth, and as far as I can
determine, Northtown, which is where a lot of the allocation went
in this bond agreement, is a very small, the smallest part of the
overall bond refinancing that was done, I think, two or three
years ago, so to say that we have some specific debt to repay is,
I think, not quite right, since we are a tiny drop in the overall
refinancing of this. But I want to return to my initial
question, [which] was... If you folks succeed in...
First of all, why are you so interested in getting one-time
money, number one, and number two, if you get one-time money of
$2 million, or $5 million, or $10 million, is that enough or is
the sky the limit? If you can get another ten, another
ten, is there some upward limit to how much... to when you guys
are going to be satisfied.
Mary Beth Labate: Can I just... The
suggestion that... of when we will be satisfied suggests that in
some way this money is going into our pockets...
Steve Marcus: No, I know it is not...
Mary Beth Labate: The State will pay for my
hotel bill tonight, and that's about...
Steve Marcus: I'm fully aware that you're not
profiting from...
Mary Beth Labate: But, but, but... and I
guess how much will satisfy...? The question is, what are
the needs of the community. If everyone were to sit here
today and say this community has no needs that can be addressed
with a financial contribution, then I guess we've had
enough. I think it's clear, though, that the community
does have needs. You know, again, we're not raising money
for the sake of raising money. We're raising money to
address what I think people will agree are real capital needs out
there. I think you referenced, how will it be spent?
I would imagine that once the money comes in we will hear from
the residents in full force how... what kinds of needs are out
there. The question on getting it all up front and what
that will do to the future years, clearly, the resources have to
be husband[ed] carefully. We can't shoot it all in one
wad. But, at the same time you have to understand that
these are new revenues coming in. We are self-supporting
now on an operational basis, so the new revenues more or less are
not needed to sustain us, provided that we can continue to bring
in the revenues we currently take in, we should be able to remain
self-sustaining operationally.
Steve Marcus: So what you're saying...
Mary Beth Labate: [UNINT]... available for
capital.
Steve Marcus: What you're saying, from what I
understand, is that you don't particularly need new
revenues...
Mary Beth Labate: No. I'm saying we don't
need the new revenues to remain self-sufficient on an operating
basis, with current costs. Obviously, if costs increase,
and revenues do not increase, we would need new revenue
sources. And I think you can always anticipate that costs
do rise and so obviously in the future we may need new revenues
to keep up with current costs. The primary purpose of the
new revenues, and again not all those revenues, are to consider
new infrastructure improvements?
John Mannix: Is there an implication in your
question that in your view the Island needs no capital budget and
no capital infrastructure improvements.
Steve Marcus: No.
Mary Beth Labate: OK, that's then our
question... [UNINT]
John Mannix: I suspect that you could
yourself...
Steve Marcus: How much do you need?
John Mannix: I suspect that you yourself sitting
there without even taking a walk could come up with five to ten
million dollars worth of infrastructure improvements that we hear
about every month when I come to the meetings. So I
frankly find the question a little disingenuous. It's
clear... It's clear that there needs to be capital funds
available for this RIOC, this real estate company, to support its
infrastructure.
Steve Marcus: For years, under prior
administrations, we had capital budget allocated to us, so that
we could do this...
John Mannix: That was yesterday. This is
a new world.
Steve Marcus: This is a new world, and it may be
the old world in the next administration, so my question to
try... Honestly, when I look at the amount of development
that's going on, I'm horrified by it. I don't think it's
going to make this place a better place. I think it's
going to make it a worse place, and really [APPLAUSE], Mr. Kayser
says he's doing this for the good of the residents here.
This is not good for the residents. And, in fact, I don't
even think it makes... How many of you -- and you don't
have to answer this publicly, if you want to, it would be nice --
how many of you really think that Southtown and the whole
financial deal -- we won't even talk about the aesthetics -- is a
good deal? I mean, are you guys happy with it? You
guys sold off 19 acres of about the finest land that you can find
east of the Mississippi, for what looks to me like peanuts.
I mean...
Nancy Reuss: I'd like to address the issues you
brought up about the State budget. The State budget is an
over-$60-billion-dollar budget, and you cannot sit there and say
you don't get your fair share. The single largest portion
of the State budget is school aid. Roosevelt Island gets
its share of school aid based on the population and based on the
needs. Now there is a court case, an overall court case,
State-wide, you receive those funds. You receive your
funds in the form of social service subsidies for people who are
eligible for those subsidies, either in entitlement
programs... You support the prisoners who are in the
Corrections Systems, you support the State-wide systems with
regard to the infrastructure -- the roads, the bridges, the
general infrastructure of the State. So, there are no
other communities that I know of, and I live up near Albany, that
received what you received over a decade, and that was the form
of a direct capital subsidy. I live in the town of
Colonie; the State does not give us a direct capital
subsidy. I pay my property taxes every year. We
encourage development in the town of Colonie, including
manufacturing and businesses, so that we can raise property
taxes, so that they can pay for our services. We did not
and we have not in the past gotten a check from the State for the
capital. Now your Board is trying to be responsible and
develop a plan for you so that you will in turn have those
resources, to have infrastructure.
Steve Marcus: So you gave away the Southtown,
the 19 acres of Southtown...
Nancy Reuss: Sir, we're not arguing Southtown
with you tonight.
Steve Marcus: OK. However...
Nancy Reuss: Sir, we're not arguing
Southtown.
Steve Marcus: You know, it's like not arguing
about the 900-pound gorilla that's sitting next to you,
and...
Nancy Reuss: Sir, we are not discussing
Southtown.
Margie Smith (from audience): The financials
aren't in litigation.
Nancy Reuss: Does anyone not understand me?
Joyce Mincheff (resident, from audience):
Colonie doesn't pay double taxation. We do.
Nancy Reuss: And maam, what is your double
taxation?
Joyce Mincheff: We pay the... all of the $8.5
million that's raised here on Roosevelt Island for all of our
services that don't come from the State of New York. They
come from our rents. That's where all this money is that
you are sitting on; we are on the Roosevelt Island Operating
Corporation...
Mary Beth Labate: Are you suggesting the State
should pay your rent?
Nancy Reuss: Maam, what don't you understand
about... [UNINT]... You are not paying property taxes, which
support the Town of Colonie Police Department, the Fire
Department...
Steve Marcus: And we pay ours, too.
Joyce Mincheff: [UNINT} ...and [UNINT] money
that's taken out of our rent receipts that pay the $8.5 million
in services for this Island.
Steve Marcus: So we pay plenty, looks to me.
Nancy Reuss: No, you do not.
Mary Beth Labate: The notion... I do find
intriguing the notion that the State doesn't support you.
If there are particular things that you think the rest of the
State is getting that you are not getting, I'd be interested to
hear about them.
Steve Marcus: Listen...
Mary Beth Labate: You know, I'm sure...
Steve Marcus: If we stayed with the City we have
[UNINT]...
Mary Beth Labate: I'm sure [UNINT]... Medicaid,
I'm sure there are folks in Medicare, section 8.
Steve Marcus: If you guys didn't take the Lease
from the City, then we would be subject to City zoning, which may
or may not be equivalent to the GDP. But at least we would
have something that was respected, that we could go to and say,
no, this is not permitted... this is the sort of zoning which is
not permitted. OK? Now we have some sort of
amorphous moving, some amorphous thing called the GDP which
[UNINT] frequently...
Mary Beth Labate: If we didn't take this from
the City [UNINT]... it would not exist.
Steve Marcus: Hmmm?
Mary Beth Labate: If the State did not enter
into an agreement with the City the community would not
exist. UDC would not have...
Steve Marcus: It's conceivable... It's
quite probable that the City would have developed it...
David Kraut: Are you aware what the City's plans
for this Island were before the Roosevelt Island concept was
created?
Steve Marcus: No, what was it?
David Kraut: High-rise luxury housing from one
end of the Island to the other. You can see the drawings
that are down in the RIOC office. They hang them up
there. One huge 60-story high-rise, high-rent, fair-market
rent, apartment building after the next was the City's plan for
this community.
Steve Marucs: Do you think that's a good
idea?
David Kraut: No, as a matter of fact, I like
what I have right now.
Steve Marcus: You like what you have right
now.
David Kraut: Yep.
Steve Marcus: Are you going to like it when all
these projects go through.
David Kraut: Well, so far I know of Southtown
being built now, and we had some discussion tonight about
Octagon, and I gave my reasons for voting for that one, so what
are all these projects.
Steve Marcus: FDR Park is coming on line,
OK?
David Kraut: Excuse me?
Steve Marcus: FDR Park, you guys need...
David Kraut: What FDR Park?
Steve Marcus: Southpoint.
David Kraut: Oh, Southpoint.
Steve Marcus: But it's...
David Kraut: I've been on this Island 22
years. I haven't seen a park there yet. How do I
get one? Just tell me how to get one. You give me a
proposition that'll get me a park on Southpoint and I will vote
for it, I will make this Board vote for it. All I need is
a good idea, and I've only been asking for it publicly for two
years. I haven't heard it yet from any level of
government, or from any resident here.
Steve Marcus: Maybe you need a little more
patience.
[MULTIPLE VOICES UNINT]
Robert Ryan: Once again, there is a person who
is posing questions to the Board...
Mary Beth Labate: I would just add to what Dave
said. We need good ideas and we need money to pay for
them. Good ideas are easy to come by...
Steve Marcus: [UNINT] ... I have no problem when
you solicit one if this lady stands...
Mary Beth Labate: No, I'm suggesting, good
ideas, I'm sure we're all filled with wondrous ideas of what can
be done on the Island. The other part of that equation is
how to pay for them, and I invite you to give us suggestions on
that, too, knowing that no one has stepped forward with a free
lunch here.
Leo Kayser: Madam Chairman, one of the questions
the speaker posed which hasn't been answered yet, responded to,
was why were we emphasizing taking capitalized up-front payments
as opposed to long-term lease payments, and I think that's a good
question. I thought that was a good question, and one of
the reasons is when you sell off the leased parts of this lease
that is in RIOC and you have some developer or some project, or
some developer that's going to be responsible for whatever the
project is that's going to be placed in the facility, in the
designated area, we do not want the risk, financial risk, to be
on this corporation and its citizens. We'd like the
financial risk to be placed upon the party who is proposing to
take the action that results in the bid which gives them the
opportunity to move ahead. By having the capitalized up-
front payment that risk shifts to the party who's going to be the
developing party rather than the citizenry out here through this
corporation. So that's one of... It's a risk-
shifting mechanism to take the risk away from RIOC and place it
upon where we think the risk ought to be, which is on the party
who is proposing to do whatever [is] being proposed to do.
Steve Marcus: You...
Leo Kayser: Does that answer...? Do you
understand that concept?
Steve Marcus: Yes, but I think it implies, and I
think you've said it in the past... Mr. Ryan said it, I
think, when he said that, he thinks that the government ought to
take a back seat to commercial interests in developing Roosevelt
Island. Is that a correct paraphrasing of...
Robert Ryan: I think we have seen by the housing
development [that] was done here that if it had been done by the
private sector it would have been done a lot better, yes.
Steve Marcus: So... So you're more than happy,
and I think, Mr. Kayser, listening to your viewpoints, you're
more than happy to cede to commercial interests pretty much carte
blanche on what they develop and how they develop it. Is
that true?
Leo Kayser: Only if... It is not carte
blanche. We have a body of law, we also have contractual
arrangements...
Voice from audience: [UNINT]... body of
law...
Robert Ryan: Maam, once again the person here is
addressing... I would ask you to stop making comments
while this is going on. We're trying to have an orderly
meeting.
Leo Kayser: As a civilized society, we have
laws, which... on all sorts of different subjects. When
someone comes in to develop a piece of land or facility, they're
subject to all of those laws. If there's a contract with a
General Development Plan, they're subject to that, too. We
have SEQRA, the environmental review process; they're subject to
that. So I think it's a mischaracterization to say that
when you sell something off that it's carte blanche. It's
subject to all of the...
Steve Marcus: And who would enforce the GDP?
Leo Kayser: ...you understand what I'm
saying... Maybe you can finish my sentence for me, make it
clearer for everybody.
Steve Marcus: Who would enforce the GDP, for
example, if you were to say, OK, here's a chunk of land and
here's our price and it's X million dollars and go for it...
Leo Kayser: Well, first of all...
Steve Marcus: And these folks might,
might...
Leo Kayser: I want to answer that
question. First of all, if we were to sell some acreage
off, and somebody was to come in with a... and we're just selling
it and they're going to do whatever they choose to with it, and
they're going to pay their price, money up front, they still
have... it's still subject to an environmental-review process of
this Board, and this Board has a final say in whatever
development that might be. So we still have a... we
haven't untethered the process completely from the bidder.
The bidder has... when somebody comes in and bids, they look at
what the contract arrangements are, or what the lease
arrangements are. They know what they have to do.
They take that risk. That's what a free market
entrepreneur situation is. Risk is on the party doing what
they're going to do. They have to know how to navigate the
shoals of the various considerations, they [have] got to make
those calculations, they take that risk, and we receive the
benefit of their risk-taking operation.
Steve Marcus: OK, so you at least want to
maintain some benevolent oversight over the complete free reign
of capitalist or commercial interests.
Leo Kayser: Well, if I could just... Your
language, to me...
Steve Marcus: ... is a little provocative on
this score...?
Leo Kayser: ...discloses your perception on
certain ideas.
Steve Marcus: I'm not sure that the whole Board
agrees that unbridled capitalism...
Leo Kayser: Wait. You're...
Steve Marcus: ...is the way to develop a
community.
Leo Kayser: Your language discloses a certain
bias, and...
Steve Marcus: As does yours.
Leo Kayser: Well, I think I'm very express as to
my positions. I don't think I'm using loaded
language. You use language which is conclusory in nature,
in my opinion, that discloses a hostility toward, to me, some
very natural-law principles which, which I think are just
incorrect, and we have...
Steve Marcus: I'm not [UNINT]
Leo Kayser: [UNINT] Let me just finish,
please. I have a difference of opinion with you, based...
it's an honest... I'm not suggesting that your opinion...
that there's anything incorrect about your right to take your
position, but we have a different point of view, based upon
understandings of the way things work. And I'm...
My objective, I think, is as good as yours. I don't think
that I'm any less desirable in trying to get a terrific result
for the people that I'm here trying to do what I'm trying to
do. I think that the mechanisms, the processes, that I
would apply, are going to get a better result for people than
what you're trying to do. And I'm not questioning your
motive in terms of what you're trying to do. I just think
you come out with a less desirable result. That's all.
Steve Marcus: I'm not at all... I don't
intend any personal hostility, nor do I question your morality or
your goodness. However, we live here and we would urge you
not to screw the place up too much. Thanks very much.
[APPLAUSE]
Mary Beth Labate: [UNINT] ...person who signed
up
[CHANGE OF RECORDING MEDIA]
Nurit Marcus (resident) [picking up mid-
sentence]: ...real estate entity. I would like to
ask you if you also see people living in those walls, or if
you're treating Roosevelt Island only as walls that need to be
sold, changed, maneuvered, and so forth. Do you see the
aspect of people, and I really want to go back to the question of
those developments. Do you really think those are good
ideas for people who live here?
Mary Beth Labate: Again, the issue of, do we see
the people. We're not attempting to raise capital in a
vacuum for the sake of raising capital. We're not a for-
profit entity. We're attempting to raise the capital in
order to feed it back into the community for what we believe, and
I would hope that you would agree, after a review, are the
critical capital needs of people on this Island.
Nurit Marcus: And those could be worked out,
like David Kramer says, he's trying to save a tree. We can
save more than that. We can save a space between
developments. We can make it a pleasant place for people
to live in and to work in, for you, and we can actually negotiate
and talk about things, and I just hope that you would not see
everything as a closed deal, that those developments are not all
closed up, that Southtown is not a done deal, that we can still
talk about it, because we really don't want to go to court to
make a point. We can make it here at home, and I would
like you to open up to that. That's all.
[APPLAUSE]
Mary Beth Labate: Lee Edelman?
Not here.
Mary Beth Labate: OK. Ethel Romm?
[UNINT VOICES FROM THE AUDIENCE] Ronald Vass?
Ron Vass (resident): My name is Ronald T.
Vass. I've lived here since 1978, was a director of that
corporation for 12 or 13 years, and I'm here today as a resident
of Eastwood and as a Chairperson of the Eastwood Building
Committee. And, talking about services, just very briefly,
Eastwood, which is across the street, 1003 apartments, I believe
everybody is familiar but maybe not very familiar, we have 1003
apartments, about 40% of the people there in some way, shape, or
form, are subsidized. But we're lucky. Every two
years we get a rent conference or a rent hearing in front of
DHCR, where we have a chance before imposed upon us a rent
increase, we have a chance to debate services, which I heard a
lot about services and cost tonight, and they even give us a
stipend of $3000-$4000, to hire an accountant or a lawyer to
debate those various items in a rent hearing. We are going
to use the money from the State to hire an accountant to argue
rents. I'm here to talk specifically about Public
Safety. The residents of Eastwood are very, very unhappy
with the services, and just to make it clear, again, I'm not sure
the off-Island people are familiar with the way Public Safety
works here, as far as the operation and financially.
Eastwood supports... the buildings on the Island pay for
50% of the operation of Public Safety. We're talking, I
believe, in the area of $2 million a year. But the
building I live in, Eastwood, pays 40% of that half, or roughly
$1000 a day, roughly thirty-some-odd thousand dollars a year,
close to $400,000 a year. For this, because of this, we do
not have the New York City Police Department on the streets of
New York. What has happened to us is that the current
Public Safety, the way it is structured, is not servicing
us. It is not taking care of the buildings and is
rationalizing to the Police Department of the City of New York
that we do not need them on the street, because the New York City
Police Department works on statistics, and anyway we, the
residents of Eastwood, with our own money, are hiring an attorney
to represent us at a rent conference, Rob. And my
attorneys have just written you a letter, I have just put a copy
of it on your desk, I don't know if you've read it before, have
you? What we're asking is some simple cooperation from you
to give us the democratic opportunity. We are subsidizing
Public Safety, we're paying very dearly, and some of the
people... I don't mean to interrupt you, I'm sorry...
Mary Beth Labate: Go ahead.
Ron Vass (resident): What I'm asking of RIOC is
very simply, and I'll read the letter: We've hired an attorney
to represent us, not to sue you, but to discuss and explore
Public Safety, on behalf of the Eastwood residents, and
thereafter hopefully to negotiate a new contract, because yes, we
are paying for that service and we are not getting that
service. I'd like to read that letter from our attorneys
to Mr. Ryan. It reads as follows:
[READS LETTER]
Our hearing will take place somewhere around late March or
early April. The date was given to us; we asked for a
postponement. Mr. Ryan, can I ask you publicly, may I get
these documents from you without a FOIL?
Robert Ryan: Well, first of all, a lot of those
documents you were mentioning dates like 1979.
Ron Vass: Yes, sir.
Robert Ryan: That's before RIOC even existed, so
it probably isn't RIOC you're asking for these documents, You
probably have to go to UDC, I would think.
Ron Vass: Well, then, I've gotta ask you...
Robert Ryan: ...or the Management
Companies...
Ron Vass: Rob, this letter of agreement which
we're spending hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, just in
Eastwood, is based on a one-and-a-half-page letter, with a
description, and describes these items. I would say that
at some juncture I'm going to pressure you very hard and get this
community to pressure you very hard, because we have to expose
what we've spent our money on, because, though I've met with you,
we're not happy and we need your cooperation...
Robert Ryan: We will give any... public
documents. I have no problem giving you any document you
want. All I'm saying is that if it's a document from 1979,
RIOC didn't even exist in 1979, and I would presume it's UDC, who
was our predecessor, basically, who would have those
documents. Anything prior to... [UNINT]...
Ron Vass: Rob, you have displaced... you have
displaced UDC here. You are committed to Public Safety
with our...
Ken Leitner: Mr. Vass, I don't think
anyone... You know, it's not an argument of whether we're
willing to provide...
Ron Vass: What can we expect, Ken?
Ken Leitner: I will tell you this. I've
only had a cursory glance at that letter, but I would need a
little more particularity as to... there's a letter of agreement
of a certain date, but it doesn't state who the letter of
agreement is between. Is it between UDC and the Housing
Management companies...
Ron Vass: Are you talking about the most recent
letter, Ken?
Ken Leitner: No, I'm talking about some of the
dates and some of the letters that you asked for a particular
letter agreements... If I was just, you know, in order for
me to begin my search on this issue, I would just need to know
who the agreements are between, who the parties are to this, to
know where to start looking.
Ron Vass: If they don't exist... if they don't
exist...
Ken Leitner: I'm suggesting something also, that
if they're Housing Management, 'cause when I looked at that I
thought it might be addressed to RIOC instead of Housing
Management...
Ron Vass: No, we addressed it to both of
you.
Ken Leitner: OK.
Ron Vass: Because you share in... She
collects the rents [UNINT]...
Ken Leitner: I can tell you if these documents
exist, and we can dig them up, we have no problem sharing them
with you. That's not the problem.
Ron Vass: What is the problem?
Ken Leitner: The problem is identifying the
documents sufficiently so we can begin looking for them.
Ron Vass: Can I ask you publicly that you will
give it best efforts between yourself and Roosevelt [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: We've already said, we're more than
happy to give them... If we are in control of the
documents we're more than happy to give them to you.
Ken Leitner: I would also ask you to go back to
your counsel, who obviously has a sense of the documents because
he put certain dates on them, and maybe identify the parties to
the documents.
Ron Vass: He hasn't as long a history here as
you have. These dates, how I came by them, I think I
learned of them, or at least from the last letter, in general
there had to be a basis...
Nancy Reuss: Mr. Vass? I'm sorry for
interrupting you. I think we've concluded that if the
documents are available they will give them to you.
Ron Vass: Fine. It's...
Nancy Reuss: I'm curious. What's the
purpose of the documents? What is your point?
Ron Vass: The purpose of the whole question that
I'm asking here is we're supporting a service that's not
working.
Nancy Reuss: Based on what, Mr. Vass?
Ron Vass: We're putting three hundred and some
odd, four hundred thousand dollars a year, our buildings are not
being taken care of. I've had meetings with Mr. Ryan, he's
very happy with Public Safety. But we raised thousands of
dollars at $10 a head because we're not happy with it.
Nancy Reuss: But, Mr. Vass, what proof do you
have that Public Safety is not working. What proof?
[VARIOUS VOICES FROM AUDIENCE]
Ron Vass: Why don't you just live here? I
mean... Your answer is ridiculous. If a thousand
people at $10 a head can raise three or four thousand dollars,
they're sending you a message. You're answering me now
like Rob Ryan...
Nancy Reuss: What is not working, Mr.
Vass? What is not working?
Voice from audience: [UNINT]
Ron Vass: This community is on the line of going
over. Whatever we ask Public Safety. I don't want
to debate Public Safety with you now, Nancy, but there isn't a
person on this Island except Mr. Ryan and Mr. Fry... None
of the residents are happy. No...
Fay Vass (resident): Wait a minute. I'm
Mrs. Vass. All we're looking for is we want to see a
contract. Don't you have a contract? If you don't
have a contract, then we want to make a contract...
Robert Ryan: I have already... I have already,
Fay, said at least five times, if we have it we will give it to
you. We need....
Ron Vass: [UNINT]
Fay Vass: [UNINT] ...if you don't have...
Robert Ryan: [UNINT] ...tell you, we will try to
identify...
Fay Vass: [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: Please, could I please finish,
Fay? We will try to identify who you have to go to if
we're not in control of the document. As I said three
times, one of the documents you mention is from 1979. RIOC
did not exist. We are probably not in control of the
document. UDC probably has the document, which is now
ESD.
Mary Beth Labate: May I just remind...
Can I...
Ken Leitner: You make mention of a document that
makes reference to some of the documents that you made reference
to and your counsel makes reference to here. If you could
provide us that, that would be a good starting place also.
Ron Vass: I'm asking you to provide...
Mary Beth Labate: [UNINT] ...Mr. Vass, we're not
certain...
Ron Vass: I don't like when the man shrugs his
head, and I've been to meetings and I'm being forth...
Mary Beth Labate: OK, I'm not a man and I'm not
shrugging my head, so let me finish. We are simply saying
we are not clear on what documents you are requesting. If
you could help us in that clarification, it would proceed...
Ron Vass: I would also like some proof...
Mary Beth Labate: And I would also like to
remind you that we have the Board... In recognition that
there are some concerns, or may be some concerns, about Public
Safety...
Ron Vass: [UNINT]
Mary Beth Labate: We have assembled a Public
Safety Committee...
Ron Vass: [UNINT] ...not here... We have
Nancy who comes here once a month; you've got people who don't
live here. You've got a woman who walked out who's the
head of the Public Safety Committee, hasn't got the vaguest idea
of what the hell's going on here, and we're tired of it.
We haven't got the patience for a six-month study. We want
to have action right now, and at the rent hearing we have an
opportunity to discuss why we're spending the money. I
would like to have the validity of what's going on here.
There is no validity to what you are controlling, because we're
paying for it and we're not getting it.
Fay Vass: You must have some kind of
contract. All we're asking from you is we want to sit down
with the Eastwood Building Committee and we want the
contract. If you don't have the contract, we want a new
contract. We have stipulations, we know what we want in
Eastwood, and stop laughing because you don't live here and you
don't know what's going on...
Ron Vass: Who's laughing? Who's
laughing? So who's laughing?
Mary Beth Labate: Leo never laughs.
Ron Vass: Oh, Nancy, you don't have any idea
what goes on in this community or you would not have asked the
question.
Fay Vass: [UNINT] ...graffiti... [UNINT]
Ron Vass: We're sick of it.
Nancy Reuss: I see no reason to personally
attack me...
Fay Vass: [UNINT]
Ron Vass: We don't want to be treated in a
condescending manner. We're very concerned and we haven't
got the patience to run on and on with a new study for six months
or a year.
Mary Beth Labate: OK, OK.
Nancy Reuss: I asked you to give me some
examples, that's all I did.
Ron Vass: I will... Would you have a
representative at our hearing, because we have a... we will
prepare speeches, documentation... See, we have a
problem. Public Safety is the only source of
documentation.
Mary Beth Labate: OK. OK.
[Various voices off-mike]
Mary Beth Labate: I encourage you, rather than
dismissing the fellow Board members, some of whom are... rather
than dismissing them in the tone that you did, that you seek to
actively engage them with some of your issues.
Ron Vass: I don't have the time to actively
engage them with my issues. We have long [UNINT]...
Mary Beth Labate: [UNINT] ...you have the time
to come here. We just ask that you make the time to talk
specifically...
Ron Vass: Nancy, can I ask you a couple of
things?
Mary Beth Labate: OK, we understand your point
and you will get the documents.
Ron Vass: [UNINT] ...closed half of the day...
open up 24 hours a day. We don't have ample service in the
buildings as we are supposed to have and we are supporting a
service that is nonexistent. There is a big diminishing of
services in this building.
Mary Beth Labate: It seems that one of the
issues may be a distinction between services and Public
Safety... public services and Public Safety?
Voice from audience: No.
Ron Vass: Public Safety is supported by our
rents.
Mary Beth Labate: Right.
Ron Vass: Somehow we have not utilized it
properly...
Leo Kayser: Madam Chairman, I...
Wait...
Mary Beth Labate: I...
Ron Vass: I'm sorry if I bored you. I
would like to get the documentation or a reasonable
facsimile...
Mary Beth Labate: Yes. Would the resident
Board members like to comment on the safety or lack of
safety?
Patrick Stewart: Yes, I would. I
would. And I think that I believe at the last Residents
Association meeting we discussed this. I think, if I hear
the Board correctly and I hear you correctly, I think we're both
trying to get to the same point but by different routes.
Now, one of us is going down the wrong road, but that's OK.
I think that to help us, Ron, it would be very advantageous if,
in fact, you could give the Board a bill of particulars...
Ron Vass: Patrick...
Patrick Stewart: Let me finish...
Ron Vass: I don't have a file, and I don't run
the business over here.
Patrick Stewart: Ron, let me finish, would you,
please?
Ron Vass: Yeah.
Patrick Stewart: So we can all get on the same
page here. If you could furnish us a bill of particulars,
if you have it. If you don't have it, then could you give
us some very broad aspects of things that you're concerned
about? With regard the documents that you're asking for
from RIOC, if you could be specific about the documents you would
like to have from RIOC, I think I heard Mr. Ryan say that he
would make them available if he knew what they were that he could
make available. I think a reasonable person here would say
that if I have a complaint and I have a bill of particulars or I
have certain documents that I need, then I perhaps would go hire
a lawyer. But until I had those things, I don't think I'd
go hire a lawyer. But that's my opinion...
Ron Vass: That's your opinion, Patrick, I don't
agree with you.
Patrick Stewart: I know you don't.
Ron Vass: I don't agree with you at all.
Patrick Stewart: I know you don't. We'll
do away with the academics of this. If... The very
practical matter here is, Ron, if we, the Board, and the
President of RIOC, the Chief Operating Officer, could receive a
document or documents that are as specific as...
Ron Vass: There...
Patrick Stewart: Let me finish... specific as
you could possibly make them, it would make it easier for all of
us.
Ron Vass: Patrick, thank you for your
help. It's been wonderful again. I would like to
see some kind of a support to what we're doing. I would
like the response in some way before our public hearing,
Rob. Thank you very much.
Mary Beth Labate: Thank you.
Voice from audience: [UNINT]
Mary Beth Labate: That's the last
published...
Joyce Mincheff (resident) I'm speaking for Lee
Edelman, thank you. My name is Joyce Mincheff...
Joan Christianson (off-mike, from audience):
[UNINT] ...what Ron was saying. One of the examples of
diminished services in Eastwood, when we first moved here we had
patrols in our hallways on a constant basis. Security is
not in Eastwood hallways anymore, and they were constantly in
Eastwood hallways years ago. Another example of what I
consider, not just in Eastwood, an Eastwood issue, you have
security guards that complaints are put in against and nothing is
ever done about it. Public Safety has been sued within the
past year several times, that I know of, personally know, and can
give you the names of the people in those lawsuits. And it
comes down to inadequacy of Public Safety.
Joyce Mincheff: I have several matters I want to
raise. One of them is, I know that you discussed this
issue before I got here, but I don't know whether this particular
aspect of it was brought up, and that is: My car has been robbed
or vandalized in the Motorgate garage three times over the last
couple of years. I understood from a Public Safety officer
that I met in the Motorgate two weeks ago that there were five
break-ins in one week in one week in the Motorgate garage.
The fact that you people are planning to raise the storage rates
in the Motorgate garage when you're not providing adequate
protection for the cars that are under your, you know, that
you're supposed to be securing in that garage, is absolutely a
slap in the face of everyone who is forced, literally, to garage
their cars there, number one.
John Mannix: Is the statistic of five break-
ins... Was it last week, or.
Joyce Mincheff: It was about five weeks ago.
Robert Ryan: Jim? Jim, maybe you could
come up.
Joyce Mincheff: Going beyond that, let me say
also, I'm a long-time resident here. I've lived here, I
think, 26 years or something, I've lost track. I've lived
here longer than the Tram. I actually lived on Roosevelt
Island three months before the Tram opened. I moved to
Roosevelt Island because I saw all of your advertising that
indicated that Roosevelt Island was going to be a residential
community. It also proffered a lot of visions about what
this community was promised to be. And at this point what
I hear, 
particularly in Mr. Kayser's plan, is that
you're not following through on the promises that were made to me
that lured me to this Island in the first place. If you
were anything but the State of New York, that tactic would be
called "bait and switch." You are the State of New York, and I'm
just letting you know in the most forthright way that I possibly
can that if you do anything to alter the promise that was made to
me when you convinced me, by your advertising, to move to the
State of New York I will hold you accountable for fraud.
And I think there are very many other individuals in the
community that will do so, as well. Let me also, since
you're having a good laugh about that, I'm sure you'll be
laughing all the way to your lawyers, if, if you do
something... I'm... That's not a threat, I
guarantee you, it's not a threat. It's a promise.
The other thing that you should be aware of is that I have
reviewed the bond prospectus. Number one, Mr. Leitner
stated that you have no knowledge of a contract that existed in
19... or that would have been brought about in 1979, (a
name="bonds"> and I find that very comical because Mr. Kayser is
saying that we have an obligation to a UDC bond that came into
existence in 1976. Well, I find it rather ironic that RIOC
could have any kind of a contractual obligation for something
that preceded its existence. In fact, those UDC bonds are
secured by obligations from the buildings, and a considerable
portion of that, of the monies that are generated to pay down
that debt, are coming from Housing and Urban Development, from
HUD. The obligations that you have for the buildings don't
change, regardless... You look perplexed, yes it is, you
take a look at...
Mary Beth Labate: I'm not perplexed. I
can understand...
Joyce Mincheff: I'm sorry.
Mary Beth Labate: I'm not perplexed.
Joyce Mincheff: OK.
Mary Beth Labate: [UNINT]
Joyce Mincheff: If you look at the indenture,
you'll see that the bonds are secured by their relationships with
the buildings. And those relationships don't change one
iota and therefore the money that comes into the UDC in order to
cover this Island's responsibility to those bonds will come in
regardless of whether or not you build another single building on
Roosevelt Island. There is absolutely no reason to be
selling off the property to be paying off the bonds, because you
have absolutely no obligation to pay down that debt
immediately. In fact, the principal on those bonds will
probably never be repaid. You just refunded them in 1996,
and the likelihood is, in 30 years from now, you prob... the UDC
will probably refund them again. And at the point at which
the City of New York takes back the Island at the end of your
Lease, the reality is, what the City... the State of New York
should have done was it should have made a buy-out agreement with
the City of New York so that when the City took it back a hundred
years from now, they paid off your principal in hundred-year-old
money, at hundred-year-old rates. And if you failed to do
that, the State of New York failed to make that arrangement, they
were negligent, And it's certainly not a reason to hold this
community hostage to the State's negligence. There is
absolutely no obligation RIOC has to pay off the bonds.
Selling off property on Roosevelt Island and taking away the
parks to do so, is not an appropriate way to deal with this
community, number one. Number two, David, you brought up
the issue of having parks. Excuse me, David, but I really
don't appreciate your laughing, your snickering, and your
whispering.
David Kraut: [UNINT]... the reason I laughed is
my thought was, wow, that was number one? How many numbers
does she have? Go ahead.
Joyce Mincheff: You're a real wiseguy, David, I
really appreciate how wiseguyish you're behaving. It's
really an example of how, of your real condescending attitude
toward the community. Thank you very much.
John Mannix: I would s... I find your, I find it
so inappropriate for you to stand up here at 11:00 o'clock at
night and threaten us with a lawsuit...
Joyce Mincheff: I'm not threatening you, sir,
I'm letting you know... [UNINT]
John Mannix: It falls on deaf ears. It
falls on deaf ears.
Joyce Mincheff: I'm sorry you [UNINT]...
John Mannix: It's entirely inappropriate, it's
offensive to me personally...
Joyce Mincheff: I am offended, I lived here 26
years. This is my home, and I find it offensive what you
people do in this community day in and day out and the manner in
which you treat this community is offensive. That is truly
offensive. [APPLAUSE] We live here. Now let me
explain, OK, since we're on that subject, real quickly, really,
what the issue is here and what the problem is here, and the
problem is that we have a disparity between the State and the
State's concept of property and the fact that this is a
community. We are a community of people that have
rights. We are not simply a piece of property run by the
State of New York. And the State of New York, when they
built this community, they had an option to build it in its
totality. They failed on that option, and they also failed
that when they did so, and people moved into this community, that
those people, this would be their homes, and those people have
rights. And you people on the RIOC Board treat we people,
here in the community, as if we are nothing but State property,
and we find that totally offensive, day in and day out, as long
as we're here. And the last thing that I
wanted to state had to do with the fact that you have eliminated
the parkland, David, you mentioned the issue of having ways to
raise money for parkland, well, we had raised money for parkland,
and Robert Ryan signed that away on October, excuse me, on
September 30, 1999, when he signed the superseding agreement with
the Department of Environmental Protection, which enabled you to
take $3.4 million into your pockets and trade down the
landscaping that the DEP owed us for the park. And yes,
there was an agreement, Nancy... [UNINT]
Robert Ryan: Excuse me, Joyce. Excuse
me. I have responded to this repeatedly, and...
Joyce Mincheff: No, you haven't...
Robert Ryan: ...certain people in this
community... Yes, I have, and I responded it to earlier this
evening, OK, and people repeatedly say that money was dedicated
for park. It was not...
Joyce Mincheff: I have the agreement, Rob...
Robert Ryan: ...there were... If you knew
the facts.
Joyce Mincheff: I have the agreement, Rob...
Robert Ryan: If you knew the facts, if you knew
the facts, you would know that there are DEP funds that will be
made available when the water tunnel is completed. I am
so... [UNINT]
Joyce Mincheff: I have spoken with Diane...
Robert Ryan: [UNINT]... Well, I don't know who
you're speaking...
Joyce Mincheff: I spoke to the woman who signed
the agreement. Her name is Diane Chapin. She is the
assistant commissioner of the Department of Environmental
Protection. I spoke to her approximately six months after
she signed that agreement. I spoke to her after you
indicated that you still had an agreement for her to complete the
park. When I spoke to her she said, "We'll give you a
couple of bags of grass seed and we'll rake the place, and I
wouldn't call that a park." Now, I happen to have sat on the
Octagon Park Task Force, and I am aware...
Robert Ryan: That is a totally outrageous...
Joyce Mincheff: Excuse me.
Robert Ryan: ...statement. [UNINT]
Joyce Mincheff: That is what she said,
verbatim.
Mary Beth Labate: I think we...
Fine. [UNINT]
Joyce Mincheff: The Octagon Park was planned
with an ecological area, it was planned...
Mary Beth Labate: $500,000 will given toward
that ecological area. Maam, I think, certainly the Board
has a true sense of how you feel on these issues, and I
would...
Joyce Mincheff: I appreciate that...
Mary Beth Labate: ...I would beg you, unless you
have any...
Joyce Mincheff: I appreciate that, but I would
also...
Mary Beth Labate: ...anyone else who would like
to...
Joyce Mincheff: ...real... in summation, just
appreciate that for you to look seriously at your bond issue and
you will all see that that bond, that you have no obligation to
be paying off that money on that bond and I would be more than
happy to supply you with some municipal finance professionals
that can make this explanation to you in a way that you can
understand.
Mary Beth Labate: And I can tell you that there
is a debt owed to the State on the State books.
Joyce Mincheff: The debt is paid down through
the obligations of the buildings. It's identified in the
indenture. You need, you need to have a municipal finance
professional give you the explanation. If you contact me,
I will be more than happy...
Robert Ryan: We have a member of the State
budget office sitting right here.
Leo Kayser: Madam Chairman, I was... I
have listened to the previous speaker and I think, basically,
there are a lot of factual assertions which, from my
understanding of the facts, are not the same [as] the speaker's
understanding of the facts. And it's very difficult to
have a meaningful discussion, and a respectful discussion, when
there's a disagreement... a basic factual disagreement.
Now, I might say that in terms of my own background... I've been
General Counsel to a municipal bond house, my family has owned,
from time to time, a municipal bond house, we've been involved in
municipal finance for about a hundred years. I've read the
documents, and I just don't come to the same conclusion as the
speaker. And I just say that.
Mary Beth Labate: Well, I'd like to... I suggest
that we've all had our voices heard. We haven't...
