Joyce Mincheff
... Patrick Stewart accepting a position on the RIOC Board.
Joan Christianson
I'd like to just comment on that. People who sat in these seats
long before us worked very hard to get the President of RIRA on
the RIOC Board.
Joyce Mincheff
[OBSC]
Christianson
Excuse me, I'm speaking, please.
Mincheff
Well, say the whole sentence.
Christianson
I'm...
Patrick Stewart
You're out of order.
Christianson
Excuse me. Let me finish.
Mincheff
[OBSC]... then say... [OBSC]... ex officio...
Christianson
You know what? Really, I'm not... I'm going to ask Joyce to
leave. I don't need this. I'm trying to say something. I'm not
going to be interrupted a hundred times. I don't do that to
anyone. I do not do that to anyone. I would like... Really.
If you can't be controlled, I really would like you to leave.
Because I'm not going to sit here and be insulted throughout the
meeting, which is just starting... I'm not. So it's her or me.
Because I'm not going to sit here and listening to this. I'm
not. I'm not going to be interrupted. And nobody else at these
tables should have to be.
[MURMUSchuppert]
Stewart
Um... Yeah. Let me...
Christianson
I'm... I'm not... Can she be asked to leave? Or do I leave? I
mean, how do we do this?
Good. I'll finish. But then I'm leaving if she doesn't. I'm
not going through this any more. What I was going to say, very
plainly, was...
Shirley Margolin
Excuse me...
Christianson
...people fought for many years to get the president of RIRA to
sit on the Board.
Margolin
Right.
Christianson
...to be automatically on the Board. Since the administration...
the Governor, or whoever, failed to do that, we fought other ways
to get our President on that Board, RIOC Board, whether it was an
appointee from the Mayor of New York or whether he just got on
there because of the seat that he sits in right now. It doesn't
matter. He's there as our representative. And I... You don't
want to realize that, that's your problem, that's not mine. I
just want to state that he belongs in the seat he's sitting in...
Now I will leave.
[VARIOUS VOICES URGING HER NOT TO LEAVE]
Christianson
I want her to leave, then. Then I want a vote. I want her to
leave. That's it, very simply.
Dierdre Breslin
Since we've already made one change to the agenda, might I
suggest that we make another one, and have our guests do their
presentation, and carry on with this street fight later...
Stewart
Thank you.
Gaspard
Thank you very much.
Stewart
This is a...
Christianson
I apologize... to our guests.
Stewart
With all that having been said... [INTRODUCES SHERRY
GREGORY]
***
Patrick Stewart
Joan.
Joan Christianson
I'm not going to scream, I'm not going to yell. I apologize to
everybody for my outburst before, but I am excusing myself from
this meeting. I will not sit in on one more meeting where I or
anybody else is going to be constantly interrupted by Ms.
Mincheff, so I am excusing myself now from this meeting. As long
as she is remaining, I am leaving.
Stewart
We will get to that.
Kitty Berman
Patrick, as I recall a precedent was set many months ago that
people were able to move out in a group and I think I would like
to move that we all leave here until we settle this discipline
problem within our group, and those of us who are supporting the
idea of at least pretending to be civil to each other just get up
and leave. There's no point in sitting here, being part of a
quorum, when we are victimized time after time, every week, every
month we are subjected to somebody being pilloried or annoyed or
yelled at because of one or two people who cannot seem to control
themselves. I would like to leave and I hope some of you will
come out with me...
Stewart
Well, before you leave we may have a better solution for that. I
think that rather than inconveniencing the majority, we should
inconvenience the minority. Ms. Mincheff has clearly been out of
order, continues to be out of order, should be called for that,
and we should ask that she leave. I would like a resolution to
that... I'd rather have one person leave than all of us leave
when she is destroying the integrity of this organization and I,
for one, am insulted by it, and hope everybody else is insulted
by it. If they're not, there's something wrong. Dierdre?
Dierdre Breslin
As a person who was branded a "liar" at a public meeting, I find
it very difficult to be involved in this because I've done my
best to get the [OBSC] back, because I was advise... But
I must say I have difficulty having been branded, at a public
meeting, a "liar." So therefore I would have to abstain because
I am tremendously personally involved in this kind of behavior,
and I will once again say, "street fight behavior..."
Stewart
Well taken. I would like to have a resolution proposed for this
meeting to expel, for this meeting, Ms. Mincheff, for - what
shall we call it - conduct unbecoming a Council member. May I
have such a resolution?
Ron Schuppert
Point of order. That resolution, even if carried, requires two-
thirds.
Stewart
Frank.
Frank Farance
Could I just make a suggestion here? Look, it's not going to do
us any good to turn the temperature up on things right now, so if
we could just... we have good work to do tonight, I mean, can we
get to good work?
Audrey Berman
The First Vice President of this organization has excused
herself. She's the First VP, elected Island-wide... we're all
on the Common Council, it's true. And I know we're all for
democracy people, too, [OBSC] Patrick, as President, and
Joyce [sic] as First Vice President. We may have disagreements
from time to time, but that's democracy, and people have
different points of view, and they each get to express them, and
people can disagree, but to badger the witness and make people
feel that they're a witness, constantly, is unacceptable, and
actually, I don't know that Joyce has gotten to the point yet, in
this meeting, where she should be dismissed from this meeting, so
I'm uncomfortable making a resolution based on tonight's
activities, although if one is using past minutes and activity, I
would certainly support such a motion, but if we're going just by
tonight, I don't know that we're there yet.
Stewart
Thank you. James.
James Whalen
The point has been made. Let's get on with the meeting.
Audrey Berman
I'm uncomfortable sitting here with the...
Byron Gaspard
Excuse me. I think... I don't agree with the resolution. I
think that we can sit here all day long and point fingers and
find fault. I think we are people of passion. We have great
passion and compassion for our community, and that's why we're
here. We're not getting paid. We're volunteering and putting
our time in. And I think that this is one of the things that has
disturbed me for the last two years, is that we spend so much
time, in terms of personal attacks, and very little time in terms
of serving our community, and we need to get to the business of
doing what we're supposed to be doing, what we've been elected to
do. Let's get on with the business...
Matthew Katz
I just want to say that we have work to do tonight that affects
everyone and I think we need to hear the vote of everyone on the
Island, and the appropriate place for deciding who sits in this
chamber will be decided in eight weeks in an election, and I urge
us to get on with our business tonight. It's very important.
Rhoda Jacklin
A point was made and taken by abusive rhetoric, and I really
think that we have to resolve it once and for all for the year,
about who sits on the Council. It has happened at every meeting.
It gets to a point where you don't even want to come down to a
meeting because you know it's going to wind up as an abusive
name-calling contest here, and I think, for the good of the
council we really have to decide about the conduct of the members
here, and how we're going to conduct business from here on in.
Matthew, we do have to get to the business, so let's come to some
kind of resolution about this.
Kitty Berman
Does the Constitution say anything about the recall of a member
who is not acting in the best interest of its building?
Stewart
Yes, it does.
Kitty Berman
Does it? What does it say?
Stewart
It says several things.
Kitty Berman
Perhaps the building should take action.
Stewart
With regard to that, let me, let me just point out here for a
moment that there are 21 people in this room tonight, of whom one
has chosen herself to disrupt this meeting. [VARIOUS VOICES]
Can we have order, please? There are people in this room who
have come to this room in good faith with intent to do work. It
has been disrupted time and time again, not just tonight, but
many other times. And I'm not sure that the product of this
group of people is any the better for it. Quite the opposite, I
think it is much the worse for it. And again I go to the 21
people being held hostage by one person. That's not right.
That's not democracy. To use Joyce's words here, "I withheld the
minutes as a protest against Patrick Stewart accepting an
appointed position on the RIOC Board." Let me quote the
Constitution: "An officer of this organization may not refuse to
do a job on the basis that he or she does not like someone else
in the room." That is paragraph three, section 10 of the RIRA
Constitution. Article 4, section 3, says essentially the same
thing, layout out the duties of the Secretary under the
Constitution of this body. We've had now, not just one, but
many, violations of both of these articles, and both of these
sections of the Constitution, and I, for one, I have not been
doing this job for four years for my health. I think that this
community elected us to do better things. I think this community
and this body of people deserve better. I'm insulted and I have
been insulted for quite a long while now, and I think that Joan's
leaving the room was more than appropriate, and I refuse myself
to be held up by this any longer. Jeffrey.
Jeff Hochman
I have a feeling that this group is becoming a bit immature in
this. I mean, I have to get up and go to work like many people
here, and if we're going to spend a half-hour, 45 minutes,
discussing, really, what it is is a war between you and
Joyce.
[OBSC; VARIOUS VOICES INTERRUPT]
Hochman
One of the problems here is that everybody should give their
opinion and everybody else should stay quiet, and let them have
their opinion. No noise, no nothing, if not, then why are we
having this? That's why these meetings go 3, 4 hours. It's
everybody's fault. Joyce has an opinion. She stated it. She
may stat it too many times, but she states it. You do not... She
raises her hand a lot, and you don't pick her. You talk, she
interrupts. I'm not... It's stupid. It's immature, and we
should just get over this and go on.
Jacklin
Excuse me, but this happens with everyone. Not only Patrick.
Everyone that is speaking on a subject is interrupted constantly,
and not very nicely. So I have to take exception with your
remark and let's move on. I don't care what happens.
Breslin
I just want to remind you, Patrick Stewart, I am Dierdre Breslin,
at a public meeting I was called a "liar," and no one did
anything.
[VARIOUS VOICES, OBSC]
Stewart
May we have order, please?
Audrey Berman
If I might. If I might? I just... the issue for me is being
supportive of Joan, and if Joan felt uncomfortable enough that
she couldn't sit through this meeting, then I must tell you I
have begun to feel terribly uncomfortable about remaining here.
... my support for Joan... so if, perhaps I should voice a
resolution that we adjourn this meeting because our First Vice
President felt it too unbearable to sit through this meeting. I
don't know if that's...
Stewart
We have a motion to adjourn the meeting? Is there a second?
Gaspard
No. I have a statement.
Jacklin
Stewart
We have a motion on the floor to adjourn this meeting. We have a
second, Rhoda Jacklin...
Audrey Berman
In support of Joan Christianson...
Stewart
Yes, because of Joan Christianson. All in favor?
Heimer
I think there should be discussion.
Stewart
Not when a motion's on the floor.
Katz
Expressly when there's a motion on the floor.
Heimer
Especially when there's a motion on the floor.
Stewart
There is a motion on the floor.
Heimer
How can we vote on it without discussion?
Stewart
Ask one of our parliamentarians.
Heimer
Frank?
Farance
Can we just hold on so we can just...
Schuppert
What you have is a call to order and a motion to adjourn is
undebatable except when it's been called out of order. According
to the agenda we are still at the call of the Chairman.
Linda Heimer
Excuse me?
Schuppert
A motion to adjourn is undebatable. You can't... You have to
recognize it, except when it's out of order, and because of the
timing and our agenda, you can't bring it up. If it's after the
time on the agenda, 10:30 or whatever, and somebody comes up with
a motion to adjourn, then we would have to vote on it. At this
point, it's an improper motion.
Kitty Berman
Ron, would it be permissible to make a motion that the building
committee... that the building that elected a member should
consider recalling a member...
Schuppert
For removal of that member it would have nothing to do with the
building committee. It has to do with the Common Council. You
would need a 2/3 vote by ballot, meaning paper.
Farance
Could I also...
Schuppert
And we ain't going to get that so let's just move on. You would
need a 2/3 vote by ballot, meaning paper.
Farance
Could I just read that section of the Constitution? Just the
expulsion section?
Stewart
It's not germane, now.
Farance
OK, then I won't read it.
Stewart
It's moot. We will move on under protest.
[VARIOUS COMMENTS, OBSC]
Kitty Berman
Do you want to signal what would be the proper time if this
continues?
Schuppert
The time is in your agenda.
Kitty Berman
At 10:30 we can make a motion to adjourn.
Audrey Berman
If this continues a motion to adjourn could be at 10:30...
Schuppert
Unless the chair...
Audrey Berman
Alright. At 10:30...
Schuppert
We've wasted a half hour on something that is not going to be
moved.
Audrey Berman
That's right. Every month, we waste at least a half hour. At
least.
Jacklin
[OBSC COMMENT]
Schuppert
Joyce and I have locked horns as much as anybody at this
table...
Kitty Berman
I know that.
Schuppert
However, we have a meeting. There are important things on this
agenda that we should get to... that everybody should be
concerned with...
Kitty Berman
That's what we're here for.
Schuppert
If you're feeling so intemperate you can ask Joyce that
she...
[OBSC; VARIOUS SIMULTANEOUS INTERRUPTIONS:]
Audrey Berman
It's four times...
Margolin
Don't use a word like that...
Audrey Berman
If she said...
Kitty Berman
If the business of this group cannot be conducted in a civilized
manner, regardless of who is stopping the conducting of the
business in a civilized manner, that person is out ... should
be... is out of order. If it's me, or you, or Patrick, or
whomsoever...
Susan Waide
I'd just like to ask Ron to...
Vicki Feinmel
I've had my hand up for some time...
Stewart
I'm sorry. You're not a member of the Common Council. We'll get
to you in public session. Susan.
[OBSC; VARIOUS SIMULTANEOUS CONVERATIONS]
Stewart
Could we have order, please?
Waide [PORTIONS OBSC]
This is a just a summary... can be made any time... a meeting
calls for...
Schuppert
Except as part of a call to order, which is our agenda...
[PORTIONS OBSC] Or maybe we should just call for a vote
and get this out of the way as fast as we can.
Stewart
I would, actually, as the presiding officer... I would like this
in the minutes, please... As the presiding officer I would ask
that Joyce Mincheff be excused for unseemly behavior. That goes
into the minutes and if the Common Council so chooses it's within
our purview to take a vote on it, but I want that in the minutes,
please.
Katz
Mr. President, I see something in the Constitution about
expulsion but nothing about excusing. Is this an ad hoc
addition...
Stewart
No, this is in Robert's Rules where you throw a person the hell
out of a meeting who's being disruptive. It's very simple.
Schuppert
He's only questioning the word excluded or expelled. The word
should be expelled.
Katz
Our Constitution is clear. You can charge someone for
malfeasance.
Farance
Well, there's a difference...
Stewart
We already decided. That's...
Katz
What Frank said is not true. You can charge someone and then at
the next meeting remove them...
Farance
There's two types of expulsions. One is forever, or whatever, as
a Common Council member, and the other one that Patrick is
talking about is for the current meeting.
Stewart
Yes. OK, folks, let's go on. Just... Let's try it for five
minutes and see if we can move forward in a productive manner,
and if we can't, anyone so choosing, they can leave. Five
minutes, please. Where were we.
Katz
We were approving the minutes...
[MEMBER OF THE COUNCIL ASKS STEWART IF HE HAS FORGOTTEN THE
PUBLIC PORTION OF THE MEETING]
Stewart
Oh, I'm very sorry. I overlooked the public session.
Feinmel
Now I may...
Stewart
Now you may... Anyone else... Anyone in the public who would
like to speak with regard to anything on Roosevelt Island, please
feel free to do so...
Feinmel
Yes, I just want it noted that I understand all your anger and
frustration. I have seen so many times such inappropriate
behavior not only by Joyce. I understanding how provoking people
can be, but it really goes both ways and all of you should look
at yourselves occasionally and try seeing what you've done to add
to this situa... Kitty, excuse me, exactly what you're doing now
is provocative. OK, it's provoking. Exactly what you're doing.
And this goes on all the time and obviously you don't care what
you do, how that affects other people, but most of you at one
time or another have also been inappropriate. That's all.
Stewart
Thank you. Any other member of the public who would like to
speak?
...
