Frank Angelino (Chair, and Member, RIOC Board): We have one item that we wanted to take up to get a sense of the committee, and that is on Southtown. Southtown will be coming up shortly, possibly in September...

Jump to:     Question and vote         End

Robert Ryan (RIOC President): Well, I don't know, "in September." We're still negotiating the terms. I had hoped that we would finish this week, but we're still doing, you know, the financial terms. But we'd love to get an idea of what the committee thinks about the project.

Angelino: Yes, I thought this would be a good opportunity for us to go around the table and just state their views and...

Mary Camper-Titsingh: Would you describe it, just quickly, once again?

Angelino: The Southtown proposal?

Camper: Yes.

Angelino, Ryan

Angelino: Let's see if I can do it justice. It's a proposal...

Camper: Or maybe Ryan.

Angelino: We would be designating the final designation of the developer to build on that area that we've been describing, and I don't know exactly the geographic...

Ryan: Well, it basically runs from the soccer field just south of Blackwell House down to the Tram.

Camper: The whole thing.

Ryan: The whole thing. The Nurses Residence and everything else.

Angelino: Developing in accordance with a plan that we've seen for housing plus certain amenities, as it's been developing. But what we want to do is, we've taken a vote to make them preliminarily designated, but we want to take it to the final designation in order for them to continue to go through the processes they've been going through -- holding their hearings, working out details on the whole proposal. This designation would give them the ability to go out and say, "we are the ones designated and we're trying to raise financing and do other things to make it happen.

Ryan: They have a tremendous amount of engineering and stuff that has to be done. They don't want to, you know, unless they have this... spend the money, obviously.

Camper: Yeah.

Parnes: What does the...

Marc Diamond: ...final approval?

Angelino or Ryan: Yes.

Parnes

Laurence Parnes: What does that designation do in terms of, because what we saw the last time was, I would call it more vast than a schematic site, but it didn't sound like it was the final site plan. And they were unsure as to the type of housing that was going to be built, so what... what does...

Ryan: Well, you know, you see, they, that is, what comes first, the chicken or the egg? Because they... the cost of doing the final site plan is going to be a great deal of money. We're talking probably in the millions. So that's why they want to, you know, uh, have this designation. As far as the housing goes, we're... [crosstalk; Ryan restarts:] As far as the mix goes, and I can't totally get into specifics, because they're in negotiations, but a, how can I put this, a major New York medical facility is very interested in taking one of their buildings for staff housing. And they would be regular apartments, but you'd be, uh, the medical facility would be the person picking up the tab on that, and that would be one of the first portion to go in, which I think would be very positive because you got a user that will move right in and these are people who are going to be working on the east side of Manhattan. They're going to be professionals, and, uh, that is the first building that would go up.

Parnes: Let me ask a question, and it's more of a process thing, because, after final designation is approved, what future actions does the Board have to take in terms of the project, or does that, OK? And if the Board does have to take future actions, will the Board look for input from this committee on those actions, or is it done, at this point, once final approval is...

Camper: Yeah.

Ryan: What the Board would be doing, as far as this committee is, uh, involved, I don't really know the answer because I don't think we've ever been down this road before. I'm sure the Board would want input, but most of the stuff that will be taking place from that point on will be having to do with engineering, uh, you know, construction schedules, stuff like that. And a lot of it's going to be with our consultant, uh, reviewing the stuff to be sure you have validity, Vinnie will be reviewing a lot of the stuff. So it's going to be more of a technical process to be sure that everything is being done right.

Angelino: There are issues, Larry, that become of concern that we could bring it back before the committee. They certainly showed a willingness to come to just about every meeting on the Island, so I think that they would be very happy to come back before the committee.

Ryan: I'll tell you what one of the concerns is here, one of the reasons that we're bringing it up. Part of their thing with this medical institution is that they have to be in the ground by a certain time or the deal's off, so what I was concerned about was it wasn't covered... if it wasn't covered at this meeting, we're going to have to bring everybody back to discuss it again and it will slow down the whole process. We can do that if everybody feels the need to but they were going to brief everybody at the last meeting, in June, on where they were and where it was going, and the only thing that has changed is they have a tenant to take the first building.

Camper: But building height and everything, that's already been determined, for all the buildings.

Ryan: No, I don't think they've even designed...

Camper: But I mean will we have any control over that?

Vincent Kopicki, RIOC Engineer: I can't recall off-hand, but there is, I mean, on the schematic there is a layout of tiered buildings.

Camper: And they're going to stick to that?

Diamond: It wasn't presented to us as final.

Kopicki: I don't know if that's the final plan, but I...

Parnes: I'm, again, I'm curious about where we go and...

Ryan: Well, I mean, I can assure you that you'll be briefed during this process. They're sort of in a state of flux because all of sudden with this new thing their whole plan has changed.

Parnes: I understand that. I understand the timing. But I think what I would try to understand is...

Ryan: Well, I think you're trying to say that you want to be part of the process and you feel the committee should be part of the process.

Parnes: Well, if the committee does... I want to know what happens. I mean, one of the things we ran into with the minischools is clearly an issue over what was approved originally and that type of thing. So I just wanted to be clear what this means. Then we can decide how we proceed on that. So we saw, the developer made a presentation at a town meeting, I think, where he laid out a scheme, made some comments about the heights of the buildings, talked about the... I think he was going to have a central, town center type of thing, and I think that was generally met favorably. The question is to what extent is he bound at all by that concept, and if not, what, you know, he's not, what does he have to go through to change it, or can he go now and build...

Ryan: Well, the design... OK, the height, I'm not sure on the height of the buildings. The design that was laid out is the design that they have given us a schematic of, will be the design of the... The footprints of the buildings and everything, none of that is going to change. You've got the park area or whatever you want to call it, going down where the subway tunnel is, in the middle there, so it's the same basic layout, I think, that you've been dealing with. Vinnie, you've been here through this entire process, I haven't. Isn't it the same...

Kopicki: Yes, basically it's never changed.

Ryan: Yeah, it's the same layout. What the heights of the building are, I don't know off-hand.

Angelino, Ryan, Hochman

Jeff Hochman: But there's other things that we should know, like what is the uses, in other words, what kind of housing is it going to be, we haven't got any answers there...

Ryan: Well, let me put it this way. The, the, the housing is going to meet the mix, OK, that has been discussed, OK, and they made that very clear. And so I don't there needs to be a concern on that level.

Hochman: I hate to be technical, but when you say the mix, is that something in writing, and when you say the mix, what exactly does that mean. A lot of this stuff that we're talking about is still for us unclear as to what it all means and where we come in, and I'm still unclear, I...

Ryan: This is part of this, you see, we're, this whole process, the way it works. and I understand your concerns, and also, the developers, you know, it's the type of thing, they can't get to a certain level to explain a lot of these questions until they have the approval to do a lot of the background work.

Parnes: I understand what you're saying, but do they have to come back to the Board, because we're an advisory group that... Do they have to come back to the Board after this for further approvals, and if so, what are they? Or are they now free to develop as they see fit consistent with...

Ryan: No, they're going to have to come... I mean, Vinnie, don't they have to come back with all the plans?

Kopicki: Oh, yeah, they have to come back with partial plans for approval.

Parnes: And does that require Board approval, as well?

Kopicki: That I do not know.

Angelino: If I may, at this point, because I know that the questions are all vital and also very appropriate, I think that what I was thinking that we could do tonight, knowing what we know so far about Southtown, knowing who the developers are, knowing that they have gone through a certain community process in a number of meetings with the community, including our big meeting in March where there was that whole opportunity for everybody on the Island, knowing that they have a certain window of timing right now because of possible changes in market conditions and financing and other things, and knowing they need to make certain commitments if they want to have users along the lines of the medical facility that he was talking about, or medical personnel, and knowing also that it's going to be a phased development, we do know... I wanted to get a sense from this committee whether, up to this point,

...it would be helpful if we just went around the committee and got a sense of the committee whether, on what they've seen so far, whether... and reserving any opportunity to make any comment on specifics aspects of the project, whether or not the committee is comfortable at this point with having the Board taking it up to do the designation of these two people as the developers for the project?

they have any problems with any of the things that have been said or any of the proposal so far from the Related/Hudson people, so that we can get a sense whether the committee is generally positive as to the overall concept of what is being proposed. AS to the details, I know that the Board will be involved in an actual site plan, the buildings, the uses of the buildings, the heights of the buildings. Once that is approved, then any deviation from that would have to come back to the Board and with this new committee structure we'd have to discuss how it would come back to the committee, but I would probably see a role for the committee as things evolve. We don't have all the details; in fact, a lot of the details are sketchy in terms of some of the impacts of construction and things like that, but that's to be expected at a project at this point in time. I think, in order to move to the next step, it would be helpful if we just went around the committee and got a sense of the committee whether, on what they've seen so far, whether... and reserving any opportunity to make any comment on specifics aspects of the project, whether or not the committee is comfortable at this point with having the Board taking it up to do the designation of these two people as the developers for the project?

Ryan: You have my word, also, that the committee will be part of the process as this moves forward. I mean, it would be stupid for you not to be part of the process.

Angelino: Who wants to start, the right or the left side of the room?

Stewart, Angelino

Patrick Stewart: I'll start. Overall, I'm very much for it as presented to us. I think it's an essential thing for the economy of the Island, so on. What I have seen of the drawings and all of that is good. There are questions that I would ask and ask that they be answered in writing from both Hudson & Related and from you, Rob, is I assume that this next thing is site control, and I would like to know what is involved in site control, how long they have, what they have to do with that site if anything, and the extent of it... I'd like to have something in writing about the plans that have been presented to date and those that seem to have the general approval of the Island. I think that the mix referred to is 80-20. And I'd like to see that in writing, as well.

Ryan: Well, there's going to be, I mean, there's a whole legal document, so, 99% of this will be in that document.

Stewart: I assume... My last point is, I assume that the negotiations that you are in with them now have to do with infrastructure, and that sort...

Ryan: Well, also there are ground leases and that sort of thing.

Stewart: OK. I'm for it, with those...

Camper: Caveats.

Diamond

Diamond: I think there's probably a distinction between what... We're looking for final approval at this point, but it's final approval of the developer...

Ryan: Correct.

Diamond: ...as opposed to final approval of his project.

Ryan: Correct.

Diamond: Alright, so I think we can talk about the developer and the conceptual design... I would call it the conceptual design that he has, and future stages should require... should be approved by RIOC as they go along: conception, design development, schematic design, whatever, continues. From what I have seen, I'm in favor of final approval for this developer and his conceptual design.

Hochman: Well, I agree, but I still take... I agree with accepting the developers, but I really am still so unclear about the project. I will accept the scheme in the way they had it. I cannot go into any details at all since I really have not seen...

Camper-Titsingh

Camper: Yeah, that's the way I feel, too, frankly. The developer in fine. I wholeheartedly approve and you know, I would like to see them get started as soon as possible. But I think there are still many, many questions about what he's going to put there. I'm not so awfully sure that medical personnel that works off the Island is an appropriate to be joining our community, however, I think that is a minor point. I do worry that once we say, "OK, go ahead," that then they're going to, you know, put another story on...

Ryan: Well, this is, you see, the engineering alone is going to take eight or nine months. It's not something that's going to happen overnight.

Camper: But we want...

Ryan: No, I hear you. The committee will be part of the process. You will be briefed. In fact, if there are specific questions like Patrick brought up and everything else, in the next couple of days maybe all of you could write down the questions that you have and I'll get the answers.

Camper: I'm also concerned about the Nurses Residence. Have you...

Ryan: That is coming... They're going to pay to take it down.

Camper: Oh, they are?

Ryan: They are. And that's part of the deal with this medical facility, that, when the go in the ground, they also have to start taking it down. It has to be totally down before the apartment building is built.

Camper: That's good.

Ryan: Yes. And they're picking up the tab on that.

Stewart: So that's the first step, is knocking down...

Ryan: Well, no, the first step is going to start the building of the building. Simultaneously, or, you know, the Nurses Residence will the taken down.

Camper: OK.

Angelino: I share the same views as the ones expressed. Again, it's a process where there'll be a lengthy document which will embody all of the terms that are being discussed now and all of the obligations of the developers and all of the benefits to the Island, and there'll be a number of steps as Marc mentioned where there'll be opportunity for... and certainly... I'm sure the Board will be interested, I'm sure this committee would be interested in seeing how the design progresses so that... and especially also not only the buildings themselves but also the surrounding grounds, and I think everybody would be very interested in that, so it's a process, but I think it's helpful to have a sense of the committee that generally, with the reservations expressed, that people are generally in favor of those developers and how they've conducted themselves and presented the project to date and the benefits that the project will bring to the Island.

Camper: One more question. The problem of bringing trucks onto the Island sort of bothers a lot of us. Are they going to be rebuilding the ramp to accommodate these big trucks.

Angelino: We don't know that, and that's one of the things that as you might have read recently in The WIRE in Patrick's column mentioned about alternatives to that, and that's certainly an issue.

Camper: Have they said...

Ryan: No, but that's something they're very aware of, OK? And they understand everybody's concern, and they're going to work with us to figure out what is the way that has the least effect.

Camper: They said at one point that they absolutely were not going to bring barges, you know, bring the materials by barge, so you know, that only leaves our puny little road.

Angelino: Well, we don't know the answer yet, but that's one of the details that everybody is aware of that is of concern to people on the Island and has been made of concern to the developers and they know that everybody's aware of it.

Stewart: It's also unclear if the environmental impact statement of 1990 with regard to that subject is... Hopefully...

Angelino: OK, well, I think that's helpful on Southtown. I think we should move to mini-school now...

 
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